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Post by dbutler69 on Mar 11, 2021 8:44:38 GMT -5
OK, the first round of the Top Big Two Decade Tournament is done. There wasn’t a lot of drama in the first round. DC won 6 of the 8 matchups. Here are the results.
40’s DC defeated 40’s Marvel 18-1.
50’s DC defeated 50’s Marvel 16-1.
60’s Marvel defeated 60’s DC 28-2.
70’s Marvel defeated 70’s DC 23-4.
80’s DC defeated 80’s Marvel 23-9.
90’s DC defeated 90’s Marvel 26-1.
00’s DC defeated 00’s Marvel 13-5.
10’s DC defeated 10’s Marvel 11-1.
Now, onto the quarterfinals!
60’s Marvel vs. 10’ DC
70’s Marvel vs. 00’s DC
80’s DC vs. 50’s DC
90’s DC vs. 40’s DC
I think we’ll need to wait until the semifinals for a truly compelling matchup, though I do think that 90’s DC vs. 40’s DC in this round could be close. It’ll be interesting to see what happens there.
This poll will close Wednesday, 3/17 at 3 PM EST.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 11, 2021 10:26:16 GMT -5
I voted 70s Marvel, but I may end up changing my mind. This is actually really close for me.
Never mind. I changed my mind.
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Post by Graphic Autist on Mar 11, 2021 10:29:49 GMT -5
70s Marvel.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,707
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Post by shaxper on Mar 11, 2021 11:05:09 GMT -5
'70s Marvel was the pinnacle of comic book innovation, with magazine format, giant-size format, treasury edition format, and an explosion of new genres including martial arts, science fiction, fantasy, and blacksploitation. Meanwhile, storytelling matured, characters grew more complex and introspective, and storylines sometimes weaved across issues and even titles.
What kind of innovating did DC do in the '00s? Not being rhetorical. I honestly don't know.
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Post by dbutler69 on Mar 11, 2021 11:07:26 GMT -5
I voted 70s Marvel, but I may end up changing my mind. This is actually really close for me. Same question as I had for you in the other poll - what is it in 00's DC that makes it close? I ask out of curiosity, as I wouldn't be shocked if 60's Marvel and 70's Marvel win unanimously, and I haven't a ton of experience in post 1990 comics (though most of what I have read from that eri is DC) so I'm wondering what really good stuff is out there from these eras.
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Post by tarkintino on Mar 11, 2021 12:04:05 GMT -5
Although i970s Marvel took a creative downturn (in the second half of that decade) compared the heights of their mid-late 60s version, its still head and shoulders above DC of the '00s. Thats about as much of a fight as an ice cube dropped into an active volcano.
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Post by codystarbuck on Mar 11, 2021 12:16:33 GMT -5
The only DC stuff I was reading in the 00s, for DC were the ABC books, from Alan Moore, the tail end of Starman, and American century. Astro City, when it came out. I was reading nothing from Marvel, then, except maybe a mini-series.
I wasn't reading either in the 60s, as I was born in 1966; but, re-reading 60s Marvel sure outweighs 00s DC.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 11, 2021 12:21:09 GMT -5
I voted 70s Marvel, but I may end up changing my mind. This is actually really close for me. Same question as I had for you in the other poll - what is it in 00's DC that makes it close? I ask out of curiosity, as I wouldn't be shocked if 60's Marvel and 70's Marvel win unanimously, and I haven't a ton of experience in post 1990 comics (though most of what I have read from that eri is DC) so I'm wondering what really good stuff is out there from these eras. The last half of Transmetropolitan. Planetary. The entire ABC line (League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Tom Strong, Promethea, Top Ten, Tomorrow Stories). Ennis' War Stories. American Century. Global Frequency. 100 Bullets. Lucifer. Fables. The last 1/3 of Hitman. The end of Preacher. Y: The Last Man. The first half of Scalped. The first 2/3 of Jonah Hex. Wednesday Comics (easily as innovative as anything Marvel did in the 70s). The first half of Northlanders. Ex Machina. There were a number of interesting Elseworlds books (and a decent amount of crap). Solo. New Frontier. That's without looking very deep. Again, part of it is that I'm barely interested in super-heroes any more, and while 70s Marvel was better in that regard than 60s Marvel it was still the vast majority of their comics. And those that weren't straight super-hero stories still had that aesthetic. I'll also cop to the fact that I have major issues with the writing style at Marvel at that point (and in to the 80s). Over-written, histrionic, cliche-ridden prose that steps all over the art. Shaxper talks about format innovation, but innovation is only good if it's readable. I don't find the Giant-Size books to be particularly innovative. It's essentially a return to large quarterly comics that were de rigueur in the 40s. DC and Marvel started doing tabloids roughly contemporaneously but I think DC brought them out first in '72. The black & white magazines was a continuation of Goodman's long-term practice of following what other publishers were doing. Warren had been doing black & white comics magazines for over a decade. See also Mad, Cracked, etc. M.F. Enterprises was doing black & white horror magazines before Marvel. Clearly Marvel captured lightning in a bottle with the Howard properties. Conan and Savage Sword were very innovative. And the various cosmic books were marginally innovative within the over-arching super-hero genre. Master of Kung Fu holds up (though it's been years since I've read them so maybe not), though it would have been better if they hadn't tied it in to the MU. Iron Fist, on the other hand is unreadable drivel. And again, for everything that's marginally innovative, they failed to do anything with genres like westerns or war comics where DC was doing some interesting stuff in the 70s. I'm not saying there wasn't good stuff there. But a lot of it simply doesn't interest me.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2021 12:21:41 GMT -5
70s Marvel
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Post by brutalis on Mar 11, 2021 20:06:24 GMT -5
Excelsior! 70's Marvel of course.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Mar 11, 2021 20:27:10 GMT -5
See, I would never consider Vertigo as part of 'DC 00s'... I'm assuming the main universe. Vertigo '00 vs. Marvel '70s... Vertigo definitely wins.... Fables, Lucifer, and Astro City alone beat 70s Marvel.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Mar 11, 2021 20:36:27 GMT -5
See, I would never consider Vertigo as part of 'DC 00s'... I'm assuming the main universe. Vertigo '00 vs. Marvel '70s... Vertigo definitely wins.... Fables, Lucifer, and Astro City alone beat 70s Marvel. I asked earlier if Vertigo, et. al were included. So that's how I based my votes.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Mar 11, 2021 20:39:10 GMT -5
I guess I missed that! If that's the intent, then I'm swapping my vote
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Post by dbutler69 on Mar 12, 2021 7:17:28 GMT -5
I guess I missed that! If that's the intent, then I'm swapping my vote Yeah, it was a tough call. I hadn't really considered Vertigo when I started this poll, and I'm still not sure what the "right" answer is, but I figured what the heck, I guess we can count Vertigo. Besides, didn't some of the Vertigo stuff basically get folder into the main DC Universe eventually?
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Post by wildfire2099 on Mar 12, 2021 7:35:30 GMT -5
not from the 00s it didn't. None of the stuff Slam listed ever has been in the main DCU. In fact, there's now a 'Gaiman-verse' that's sort of its own offshoot (which is weird, since Sandman DID have a main DCU appearance or two, I believe) Its totally fine either way, It just wasn't my first inclination
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