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Post by wildfire2099 on Aug 21, 2021 7:53:18 GMT -5
Blood and honorScript by Don Kraar Art by Val Mayerik After several issues written by Charles Dixon, Don Kraar comes back for one adventure (even if the table of contents credits Dixon for the writing, probably out of sheer habit). Kraar is however properly credited on the first page of the tale, and to settle the case once and for all the first thing anyone says in it is “agheeeeeee”. Only Kraar characters go “agheeeee” instead of “aaaaah”, “aaaaaargh”, or even “aieeeeee”.  The artwork by Mayerik is very stylized, a bit like the one Luke Mcdonnell used in his Dreadstar or Suicide Squad days. It looks pretty good, I must say. The story is once again set in the Pictish wilderness, where Conan is scouting for the Aquilonians. Kraar makes use of a character he created in Conan the king #29, the Pictish chief Shooz Dinj. We saw Dinj again in CtK #30 (when he was executed) and in SSoC #112. Shooz Dinj and Conan hate each other, but it is a hatred tempered by respect; a honest hatred, if you will, the kind that Conan missed when he started tangling with “civilized” enemies. Once again, a fort manned by Aquilonian troops is threatened by a large number of Picts. Settlements have been burned, settlers have been killed, and Conan just saved a young girl from being captured by Pictish raiders. A relief column is expected, but might arrive too late as the Picts are on the move.  We readers (but not the Aquilonians) learn that part of the Picts’ anger is due to the actions of a Hyborian merchant who started selling them steel weapons but then stole a priceless relic: the fingers of dead children, including some of Shooz Dinj’s sons. The merchant having been saved from his Pictish pursuers and brought to the fort, the natives are ready to sacrifice plenty of men to put it to the torch. Not that the Picts are all that united: there is a feud between Shooz Dinj and the shaman Zinga Dur. The war chief Shooz Dinj, in particular, is losing patience after the shaman’s magic fails them again and again.  When Conan discovers the merchant’s duplicity and a pouch containing the precious fingers, he ties the man up and boldly brings him into the forest to trade to the Picts.  Appearing unexpectedly at Shooz Dinj’s campfire, he is almost speared by the natives before the chief orders his men to stand down: “the Cimmerian has safe conduct until first light”. Conan’s offer of a deal is this: the merchant against the shaman. (Conan emphasizes how the man’s magic is a puny thing that does not serve Shooz Dinj, but in actuality the Aquilonians would much rather be free of attacking sabretooth tigers and water elementals. The shaman is not as useless as he's made out to be). Conan throws the duplicitous merchant into the campfire, and as Zinga Dur protests that there is no way the Picts will honour the deal, Shooz Dinj stabs him in the back: “one worthless thing for another”. He and Conan then agree that there is honour among savages and barbarians, and the Cimmerian is given leave to run as fast and as far as he can before the sun rises, because at that moment the chase will be on. The Cimmerian barely eludes the pursuit, and as he reaches the fort only the timely arrival of the Aquilonian relief column saves his skin. Shooz Dinj is wounded and falls to the ground, and Conan is the first to reach him. The Cimmerian nevertheless allows the Pict to go away, because he doesn’t want such a honest enemy to be delivered to Tarantia’s torture chambers.  Notes: - Conan is roughly 39; this stopry probably occurs a little while before Beyond the Black river, adapted in SSoC #26-27. - Conan wears a helmet with front-facing horns, like the one he had in CtB #1-6. My guess is that it’s a typical Cimmerian helmet, something that would be easily available in those parts. I first just want to say (If I haven't before) this thread is amazing... I real labor of love that I would totally buy as a printed book. Just read this one, and I was wondering about your time line note.... I was thinking this took place after Beyond the Black River. The stragglers the join Conan and Glannis in the middle of the story say they are all that's left of the Black River Fortress. My impression has always been that Aquilonia gave up on trying to tame the Pictish wilderness after the lost of the Fortress (at least for a while)... this stockade the action takes place at feels temporary to me.. like they're holding out for the relief column so they can get escorted safely home, thus putting the story just after Beyond the Black River. Doing it that way would make more sense as to way Conan was so well known among the Picts, too... much more so than the average scout. When I first flipped through this, I really disliked the art, compared to the early issues I got (21, 22 and 47), but it grew on me as the story went on. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Aug 21, 2021 8:53:27 GMT -5
Blood and honorScript by Don Kraar Art by Val Mayerik After several issues written by Charles Dixon, Don Kraar comes back for one adventure (even if the table of contents credits Dixon for the writing, probably out of sheer habit). Kraar is however properly credited on the first page of the tale, and to settle the case once and for all the first thing anyone says in it is “agheeeeeee”. Only Kraar characters go “agheeeee” instead of “aaaaah”, “aaaaaargh”, or even “aieeeeee”. I first just want to say (If I haven't before) this thread is amazing... I real labor of love that I would totally buy as a printed book. Thanks! Glad you like it! Actually, they say that they're the last of three cohorts that left the Black River fortress four days ago and were ambushed before they could meet the relief column sent by King Numedides! Placement of these stories is usually very tentative, I'll admit, but in this case what made me think it occurred earlier are a couple of things: - The girl at the beginning is from a farm located west of the Black River. That in itself contradicts Howard's story Beyond the Black River, in which the river was the western border of the Westermarck; but granting Kraar a little freedom in his placement of borders, there should be no farm left whatsoever west of the Black River after the fall of Fort Tuscelan. (Indeed, there were no farm or settlements left east of the Black river, all the way to the Thunder river, after the Pictish attack!) - The same girl doesn't know who Conan is. In BtBR, everyone seems to know about "the Cimmerian", even random settlers minding their tiny farm. I would interpret that as a case of Conan not having been on the frontier long enough to become as famous as he'd later be. The Picts know him because he kills lots of them, but the settlers still have to hear all the stories about him. - In Moon of Blood, SSoC #39 (*edit: it was actually #46*) we learn that Conan was made a general after the events of BtBR, and charged with defending Velitrium against further Pictish assaults (Velitrium having replaced Fort Tuscelan as the Westermarck's westernmost major military outpost). Granted, there was probably a delay between Conan's actions in BtBR and his promotion, but here he's still just a scout and not in charge of anything. Even without the rank of general, I'd assume that in Velitrium he'd already have more responsibilities. I fully agree; we do see the Aquilonians playing delaying tactics in front of the unavoidable Pictish reconquest. In this issue they are evacuating the lands west of the Black river; in BtBR, they would lose even the land between the Black and the Thunder rivers. Decades later they'd lose far more than that, when old Gorm and his Picts would invade Aquilonia proper! Thanks for the discussion! Trying to piece together all the little bits of continuity in these stories is half the fun! |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Aug 21, 2021 10:20:16 GMT -5
Hmmm... Good points there. Just got the mag back out.. the actual text is:
Hold your arrows! We're friends -- All that's Left from the Column from the Black River Fortress!
I'm taking that to mean the fortress has fallen, thus this story takes place after (or I suppose perhaps during) Beyond the Black River). I think perhaps you're reading that a bit differently. Probably because the soldier's next line to Conan is:
We marched from the Black River Fortress four days ago to meet the relief column from the King. Shooz Dinj ambushed us near the swamp. They were on us before we knew it.
'Marched' definitely implies a planned, orderly thing, not fleeing after a lost battle... and one could definitely assume their being ambushed was part of the plan to take the Black River Fortress.
The actual Aquilonians in the Stockade certainly were of long acquaintance with Conan, though, so the girl could just be out of the loop.... we don't get her age, but if she's 13-16, rather than 18-20, that would totally make sense.
OTOH, I didn't know about the promotion.. that would be pretty conclusive for sure, if one assumes all the stories are all one big narrative (Which, of course, is nearly impossible, but really fun to try to make work!)
There's also the fact that Shooz Dinj isn't in Beyond the Black River... but these Picts are not quite the same as Howard's Picts for sure... I think they're a bit more, well 'civilized'. I don't recall Howard's Picts talking to anyone but Conan, and only then when he was around for a while, and it was pointed out that it was because he was more barbarian than civilized Aquilonian. I think he's a Marvel retcon more than any hint at chronology, though.
I'll have to check the store again for #39... I looked at it again today, intending not to buy more until I read the 4 or 5 more I got last week, but I found they we're actually in order, so I found some more at the beginning at the series, so that was exciting!
I'm really enjoying the original format quite a bit... I have a couple of the Dark Horse phone books that reprint the Conan stuff.. but the mags are way better, and the extra stuff is very interesting!
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Aug 21, 2021 16:14:14 GMT -5
Hmmm... Good points there. Just got the mag back out.. the actual text is: Hold your arrows! We're friends -- All that's Left from the Column from the Black River Fortress!
I'm taking that to mean the fortress has fallen, thus this story takes place after (or I suppose perhaps during) Beyond the Black River). I think perhaps you're reading that a bit differently. Probably because the soldier's next line to Conan is: We marched from the Black River Fortress four days ago to meet the relief column from the King. Shooz Dinj ambushed us near the swamp. They were on us before we knew it.'Marched' definitely implies a planned, orderly thing, not fleeing after a lost battle... and one could definitely assume their being ambushed was part of the plan to take the Black River Fortress. Yep, that's how I read it too. Yes, Shooz Dinj is pure Marvel; he was first used as an old enemy in Conan the King, then retroactively used during several earlier episodes. My mistake: Moon of Blood was in issue 46, not 39. |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Aug 26, 2021 23:08:34 GMT -5
Last week at the LCS I went back through the SSOC stash, and found that either someone tried to hide some older issues out of order, of they just weren't well sorted, and grabbed a couple more early issues, including #4.
It's square bound, instead of a regular magazine binding... it even has the price, date and title on the binding.. is that normal?
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Aug 27, 2021 5:43:07 GMT -5
Last week at the LCS I went back through the SSOC stash, and found that either someone tried to hide some older issues out of order, of they just weren't well sorted, and grabbed a couple more early issues, including #4. It's square bound, instead of a regular magazine binding... it even has the price, date and title on the binding.. is that normal? Yes, the issues I have are square bound up to issue #6 (including the SSoC annual). Congrats on finding issue #4! It's a good one, enough so that it was selected for a colour reprinting in one of the Treasury Editions. |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Aug 27, 2021 15:13:52 GMT -5
Thanks! I was pretty excited!
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 12, 2021 10:17:38 GMT -5
I've been continuing to enjoy these (and the annotations)... just read 144 and 145 today.. they are far better than I expected. I don't love Dixon's Conan.. he's more heroic and at the same time more bloodthirsty.... when did 'Count the Dead, Crom!' start happening? Seems like Dixon is trying to match Crom with Odin, which is weird since there are already Norse analogues.
I agree the Sonja story was really good depicting their relationship.
The other older ones I had were REH adaptations that I had seen before in collections... nice to have them in the magazine format. I look at the ads in some of the 70s mags and which I was around then to order some of that stuff!
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 13, 2021 10:36:54 GMT -5
I've been continuing to enjoy these (and the annotations)... just read 144 and 145 today.. they are far better than I expected. I don't love Dixon's Conan.. he's more heroic and at the same time more bloodthirsty.... when did 'Count the Dead, Crom!' start happening? Seems like Dixon is trying to match Crom with Odin, which is weird since there are already Norse analogues. I agree the Sonja story was really good depicting their relationship. The other older ones I had were REH adaptations that I had seen before in collections... nice to have them in the magazine format. I look at the ads in some of the 70s mags and which I was around then to order some of that stuff! I still hate myself for not having ordered things like the Severins' Kull portfolios (or BWS's Robert E. Howard one). Granted, I didn't have much money back then (a newspaper run only goes so far), but... You're right, Dixon tended to simply amalgamate historical and Hyborian concepts; Crom is basically Odin, Aquilonia is Rome, Nemedia is Rome as well; still, I preferred his interpretation to that of Fleisher, Jones or Yakata (although the latter has a charm all its own; just not a very Howardian one). |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 13, 2021 20:23:54 GMT -5
I agree.. it's not BAD, it's just a bit off.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2021 12:05:56 GMT -5
Just a note to Conan and REH fans, as of this morning The Cabinet Group, who hold the rights to all REH IP including Conan, has a new owner as of this morning, having been acquired by FUNCOM. Story here-M and here's the full press release... |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2022 13:02:15 GMT -5
This thread is great, thank you Roquefort Raider.
You really can't beat the first 60 issues of SSOC, the only way to read the De Camp Pastiche stories in my humble, very biased, opinion. Especially when adorned with the art of Buscema and all the great Filipino inkers of the age.
I have to admit I have a soft spot for the Chuck Dixon run with art by Gary Kwapisz.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Oct 16, 2022 18:14:10 GMT -5
This thread is great, thank you Roquefort Raider. You really can't beat the first 60 issues of SSOC, the only way to read the De Camp Pastiche stories in my humble, very biased, opinion. Especially when adorned with the art of Buscema and all the great Filipino inkers of the age. I have to admit I have a soft spot for the Chuck Dixon run with art by Gary Kwapisz. I like it a lot too, as far as storytelling goes. Its only drawback is that there's no reconciling it with the traditional Conan canon! Crom, count the dead!!! (I love that line). |
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Post by senatortombstone on Apr 24, 2024 20:57:28 GMT -5
Savage sword of Conan #189, September 1991  Cover by Ovi Table of contents
Eye of the storm, in which Conan meets the wizard Zukala again. Featuring a cameo by Elric of Melniboné! (sort of). What can one do, in which Conan faces an army. In the letters page, the editor states that “Barry Windsor-Smith was the first artist to draw Sonja for comics, in Conan #24”. That was of course in issue 23, “The shadow of the vulture”, which adapted the Robert E. Howard story that introduced Red Sonya of Rogatino, the model for Red Sonja. That issue #24 is the one that gets reprinted all the time shouldn’t keep an editor from getting such basic facts straight. But hey… any editor who brings Roy Thomas back to the Conan mags must be a good person deep down (see the announcement at the end of this review). I don't know if this ever got mentioned when you wrote this review so long ago, but i think this story was retconned out of the Conan canon in issue #241 on the top-left panel of page 11. Karanthes mentions that Conan had been to Zukala's castle twice and Conan corrects him, telling him once was more than enough. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Apr 25, 2024 5:54:07 GMT -5
Savage sword of Conan #189, September 1991 Cover by Ovi Table of contents
Eye of the storm, in which Conan meets the wizard Zukala again. Featuring a cameo by Elric of Melniboné! (sort of). What can one do, in which Conan faces an army. In the letters page, the editor states that “Barry Windsor-Smith was the first artist to draw Sonja for comics, in Conan #24”. That was of course in issue 23, “The shadow of the vulture”, which adapted the Robert E. Howard story that introduced Red Sonya of Rogatino, the model for Red Sonja. That issue #24 is the one that gets reprinted all the time shouldn’t keep an editor from getting such basic facts straight. But hey… any editor who brings Roy Thomas back to the Conan mags must be a good person deep down (see the announcement at the end of this review). I don't know if this ever got mentioned when you wrote this review so long ago, but i think this story was retconned out of the Conan canon in issue #241 on the top-left panel of page 11. Karanthes mentions that Conan had been to Zukala's castle twice and Conan corrects him, telling him once was more than enough. That is so cool! I love the way Roy would sidestep other writers' continuity errors not by flatly claiming they were wrong, but by dropping a suggestion that they might have been. He did the same after the disastrous "year one" story arc, the last issue of which saw Roy's return under the pseudonym of Justin Arthur; he had the whole thing be a story told to Prince Conn by his dad. Queen Zenobia, overhearing, just said "that's not exactly the way you told me of those events" or words to that effect, leaving the veracity of the tale left in doubt but not outright negated. That shows, on Roy's part, both attention to continuity and respect for the work of his colleagues. |
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