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Post by Roquefort Raider on Mar 19, 2020 14:08:16 GMT -5
I am lucky in that I first discovered Conan via the local library in the novel form. This was about 30 years ago. I am new to the comics so have all the comicy discovery yet to do. Nice! My first experience with Conan material was Conan the Destroyer, which I saw when I was 12. Despite its otherwise lackluster reaction from fans of the first movie and REH, I enjoyed it. Next I watched the Conan the Adventurer cartoon, in the mid-nineties - again, I liked it despite the overall disapproval of REH fans. In 2012, I began reading the reprints of Marvels' SSoC and CtB published by Darkhorse. I recommend purchasing the current Omnibus reprints of CtB and SSoC, as Marvel seems intent on reprinting those complete runs. With a few exceptions, the Darkhorse run of Conan was quite good and it is a shame that they were not able to adapt all of the REH stories, before losing the rights to Marvel at the end of 2017. I think my favorite Conan story is A Witch Shall be Born. However, as excellence it is, it is still an incomplete story. It would be nice to see Marvel re-adapt it as a year-long story arc and fill in the gaps of the original story, by focusing more on the deprivations of Salome and Constantius and also how Conan rose to power within the ranks of the Zuagirs after being taken down from the cross and before usurping Olegard Vladislov. I think A Witch Shall Be Born would make a great Conan movie. It’s the right length, it’s got varied and exotic locales, it has warfare, magic and at least one monster, plus the classic crucifixion scene. We see Conan taken down and building himself up again, and while there is no actual romantic relationship in there, there is still some sexual tension between Conan and Taramis (more so in the Marvel adaptation than in the prose story). The Hour of the Dragon would have been good too, but it was already the basis for the Kull movie.
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Post by berkley on Mar 19, 2020 16:09:45 GMT -5
Nice! My first experience with Conan material was Conan the Destroyer, which I saw when I was 12. Despite its otherwise lackluster reaction from fans of the first movie and REH, I enjoyed it. Next I watched the Conan the Adventurer cartoon, in the mid-nineties - again, I liked it despite the overall disapproval of REH fans. In 2012, I began reading the reprints of Marvels' SSoC and CtB published by Darkhorse. I recommend purchasing the current Omnibus reprints of CtB and SSoC, as Marvel seems intent on reprinting those complete runs. With a few exceptions, the Darkhorse run of Conan was quite good and it is a shame that they were not able to adapt all of the REH stories, before losing the rights to Marvel at the end of 2017. I think my favorite Conan story is A Witch Shall be Born. However, as excellence it is, it is still an incomplete story. It would be nice to see Marvel re-adapt it as a year-long story arc and fill in the gaps of the original story, by focusing more on the deprivations of Salome and Constantius and also how Conan rose to power within the ranks of the Zuagirs after being taken down from the cross and before usurping Olegard Vladislov. I think A Witch Shall Be Born would make a great Conan movie. It’s the right length, it’s got varied and exotic locales, it has warfare, magic and at least one monster, plus the classic crucifixion scene. We see Conan taken down and building himself up again, and while there is no actual romantic relationship in there, there is still some sexual tension between Conan and Taramis (more so in the Marvel adaptation than in the prose story). The Hour of the Dragon would have been good too, but it was already the basis for the Kull movie.
That Kull movie was pretty forgettable, though. It was so weak that I don't see any reason they couldn't use the story for a Conan movie, especially if they do it right, this time.
Similarly, I think they could use most of the James Bond book titles that have been used for movies and make new, more faithful adaptations. Apart from most of the Connery films and the Lazenby one, they really just took the titles and a few character names, they didn't make any attempt to use the story itself.
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Post by Calidore on Mar 19, 2020 18:41:30 GMT -5
Similarly, I think they could use most of the James Bond book titles that have been used for movies and make new, more faithful adaptations. Apart from most of the Connery films and the Lazenby one, they really just took the titles and a few character names, they didn't make any attempt to use the story itself.
I love that there are novelizations of the movies of the novels The Spy Who Loved Me and Moonraker, because the films bear little (the latter) to no (the former) resemblance to their sources. The original TSWLM would never work as a film, though.
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Post by senatortombstone on Mar 29, 2020 11:33:32 GMT -5
I just discovered this on YouTube. It is a short story told from the perspective of someone who was once a companion to Conan, which would place it the "minor character elaboration" genre:
Aside from the lack of gore and detailed killing blows and the fact that the actor playing the Stygian did not look the part, it was pretty good. I would gladly pay to watch a full-length feature based on the large story.
That this movie will never see the light of day is true tragedy:
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Mar 29, 2020 12:52:04 GMT -5
Thanks senatortombstone! I’ll go take a look! On the subject of films... I could not resist a DVD set containing Conan, Conan the Destroyer, Kull the Conqueror and the Scorpion King. My analysis? -I hated the Milius movie for a very long time, because its Conan is not Robert E. Howard’s (and because it imposed its version to popular culture in general). Now, being far less cranky than I used to, I can appreciate its qualities. It’s actually a pretty good film, if judged on its own terms. (It still has flaws, though... we shouldn’t have to wait for the credits to learn the girl’s name). -Conan the destroyer is far less awful than some critics make it out to be. Yes, it’s cheesy, yes it has a lot of crappy SFX amid its better scenes, and yes, kt is aimed at a much younger audience than its predecessor... but it’s as enjoyable as an old Sinbad movie. - The Scorpion king is actually a pretty good Conan movie at its core. It really gets the “gigantic melancholies and gigantic mirth” part! - Kull is a honest attempt, but boy... it falls far short of its potential. The cast is fun and the dialogs sometimes funny, but it never feels like anything more than a long episode of Hercules.
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Post by senatortombstone on Apr 11, 2020 9:23:22 GMT -5
Nice! My first experience with Conan material was Conan the Destroyer, which I saw when I was 12. Despite its otherwise lackluster reaction from fans of the first movie and REH, I enjoyed it. Next I watched the Conan the Adventurer cartoon, in the mid-nineties - again, I liked it despite the overall disapproval of REH fans. In 2012, I began reading the reprints of Marvels' SSoC and CtB published by Darkhorse. I recommend purchasing the current Omnibus reprints of CtB and SSoC, as Marvel seems intent on reprinting those complete runs. With a few exceptions, the Darkhorse run of Conan was quite good and it is a shame that they were not able to adapt all of the REH stories, before losing the rights to Marvel at the end of 2017. I think my favorite Conan story is A Witch Shall be Born. However, as excellence it is, it is still an incomplete story. It would be nice to see Marvel re-adapt it as a year-long story arc and fill in the gaps of the original story, by focusing more on the deprivations of Salome and Constantius and also how Conan rose to power within the ranks of the Zuagirs after being taken down from the cross and before usurping Olegard Vladislov. I think A Witch Shall Be Born would make a great Conan movie. It’s the right length, it’s got varied and exotic locales, it has warfare, magic and at least one monster, plus the classic crucifixion scene. We see Conan taken down and building himself up again, and while there is no actual romantic relationship in there, there is still some sexual tension between Conan and Taramis (more so in the Marvel adaptation than in the prose story). The Hour of the Dragon would have been good too, but it was already the basis for the Kull movie. I just finished rereading the adaption in SSOC#5. There is definitely implied romance between Conan and Taramis that was not present in the original. When Conan (not Valerius/Marcios as in the original story) rescues Taramis from prison, he reminds her that when he was Captain of Guard, that she showed him all of the secret entrances leading in and out of the City. At the end of the story, when he declines her employment offer for the dual positions of Captain of the Guard and Councilor, he recommends Valerius/Marcios for the job - and warns her that Ivga, the lover of Valerius/Marcios, has sharp claws. On the first panel on the second to last page of the story, Conan refers to Marcios as Valerius - an error (or correction) on the writer's part. Another interesting thing about "A Witch Shall be Born," is that as far as I know, it is the only work of Howard that has Biblical references. Salome the witch is clearly a reference to the daughter of Herod II and Herodias, who, according to the New Testament, was the stepdaughter of Herod Antipas who demanded, and received, the head of John the Baptist. This line from the story clearly references that beheading: "It will always be Salome, the witch, even when the mountains of ice have roared down from the pole and ground the civilizations to ruin, and a new world has risen from the ashes and dust—even then there shall be Salomes to walk the earth, to trap men's hearts by their sorcery, to dance before the kings of the world, to see the heads of the wise men fall at their pleasure.'" And of course the Crucifixion of Conan. I found this commentary on Wikipedia:
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Post by earl on Jun 6, 2020 21:49:04 GMT -5
"I was not aware of these new Glénat Conan adaptations. Do you now where I might acquire them? Might have to learn French, but it would be worth it."
I found two issues of one of these adaptations in comic form last week at my local comic shop. They refer to the title character as "The Cimmerian" on the cover but Conan on the interior pages. It was I think a 2 issue adaptation of Queen of the Black Coast. Got them but have not read them yet.
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ericp
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Post by ericp on Jun 8, 2020 22:49:52 GMT -5
Hi,
This is actually Polar Bear from years back.
I've actually gotten really into Conan recently, and I've found your thread here really helpful in terms of putting a chronology together. There's one point of continuity I don't understand, though.
In the late, late 1990s, Marvel put out a series of Conan miniseries, four of which were by Roy Thomas: Lord of the Spiders, Scarlet Sword, Death Covered in Gold, & Flame and the Fiend. Where do these four miniseries fit chronologically? I've got the Barbarian, SSOC, Adventurer, original GNs, GSs, Annuals, King Conan, & Conan the Savage in, but I can't figure out where these minis go.
Thanks in advance, if anyone happens to know.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 9, 2020 11:00:47 GMT -5
Hi, This is actually Polar Bear from years back. I've actually gotten really into Conan recently, and I've found your thread here really helpful in terms of putting a chronology together. There's one point of continuity I don't understand, though. In the late, late 1990s, Marvel put out a series of Conan miniseries, four of which were by Roy Thomas: Lord of the Spiders, Scarlet Sword, Death Covered in Gold, & Flame and the Fiend. Where do these four miniseries fit chronologically? I've got the Barbarian, SSOC, Adventurer, original GNs, GSs, Annuals, King Conan, & Conan the Savage in, but I can't figure out where these minis go. Thanks in advance, if anyone happens to know. Welcome back, Polar Bear! I don't have all those limited series, but here's what I can say about a few of them: Lord of the Spiders : It features the characters from SSoC#207-210, a tale placed right after Conan left the Turanian army in his early 20's. Those events are referred to as occurring "several years ago". Roy's magazine Alter Ego says it's set ten years or so after "Tower of the Elephant", whoich means Conan would be around 27; that means this limited series would be placed during the "lost years" of the Roy Thomas interregnum on Conan the barbarian (that never-ending 27th year of the Cimmerian's life). Conan was back in Zamora for a little while during those days, so somewhere between the end of Jim Owsley's run and the start of the "Conan year one" storyline. Death covered in Gold : (The title is actually a typo; it was meant to be "death carved in gold", according to Roy). This is clearly an early tale, which I would put a few months after Rogues in the House (Conan the barbarian #11). Conan is still a young thief, said to be "late from Zamora and Corinthia" ( Rogues happens in Corinthia). It's apparently the first time Conan was in Ophir, so an early placement seems reasonable. Conan meets Jenna in this tale, and they refer to events from Conan #6 and Conan #11 as being relatively recent. Conan would be around 19-20 at the time, according to the Miller chronology. Flame and the Fiend : That's a direct follow-up to Conan's becoming hetman of the Kozaki, seen at the end of the Conan the barbarian and Savage Sword of Conan titles. So it's set between Savage Sword of Conan#235 and SSoC#4 ( Iron Shadows in the Moon). He's 28-29. No idea about Scarlet Sword! I haven't read it. Those miniseries did nothing for me, if I'm being honest. By the way, friend, your account was not deactivated; it's still there! Would you mind editing your post accordingly, so people don't start thinking we kick people out willy-nilly? We're sure glad to see you back, though!
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ericp
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Post by ericp on Jun 9, 2020 15:46:33 GMT -5
Thanks for the help!! Shame the minis weren't that good, but it means I don't need them on the want list, anyway I've deleted the lines, but ... well, I don't seem to have the ability to PM you, & I don't think it's productive to use this space to go over the technical bizarreness. I'm not sure why I can't start threads or PM, but =shrug= maybe it's because I'm "new" here now. If anyone wants to help walk me through getting back onto the original account in a way that works, I'd be happy to delete this one.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 9, 2020 16:19:46 GMT -5
Thanks for the help!! Shame the minis weren't that good, but it means I don't need them on the want list, anyway I've deleted the lines, but ... well, I don't seem to have the ability to PM you, & I don't think it's productive to use this space to go over the technical bizarreness. I'm not sure why I can't start threads or PM, but =shrug= maybe it's because I'm "new" here now. If anyone wants to help walk me through getting back onto the original account in a way that works, I'd be happy to delete this one. Under your new identity, you would not be able to use certain features until you've posted a certain number of times (I think it's five). As for your Polar Bear account, I don't understand why it's being uncooperative... Can you log in at all? I just sent that account a test PM, and it went smoothly. Maybe there's a way to reset your password or something (I'll ask the more tech-savvy mods). *Edit* Alas, we have no way to reset your passwords. It's for our users' protection.
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ericp
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AKA Polar Bear
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Post by ericp on Jun 11, 2020 10:48:03 GMT -5
Yeah, I guess I'll stick with this one, then, as I've tried a few passwords & nothing's worked. Thanks for looking into it for me!!
--PB
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Post by senatortombstone on Dec 6, 2020 15:45:21 GMT -5
Hi, This is actually Polar Bear from years back. I've actually gotten really into Conan recently, and I've found your thread here really helpful in terms of putting a chronology together. There's one point of continuity I don't understand, though. In the late, late 1990s, Marvel put out a series of Conan miniseries, four of which were by Roy Thomas: Lord of the Spiders, Scarlet Sword, Death Covered in Gold, & Flame and the Fiend. Where do these four miniseries fit chronologically? I've got the Barbarian, SSOC, Adventurer, original GNs, GSs, Annuals, King Conan, & Conan the Savage in, but I can't figure out where these minis go. Thanks in advance, if anyone happens to know. Welcome back, Polar Bear! I don't have all those limited series, but here's what I can say about a few of them: Lord of the Spiders : It features the characters from SSoC#207-210, a tale placed right after Conan left the Turanian army in his early 20's. Those events are referred to as occurring "several years ago". Roy's magazine Alter Ego says it's set ten years or so after "Tower of the Elephant", whoich means Conan would be around 27; that means this limited series would be placed during the "lost years" of the Roy Thomas interregnum on Conan the barbarian (that never-ending 27th year of the Cimmerian's life). Conan was back in Zamora for a little while during those days, so somewhere between the end of Jim Owsley's run and the start of the "Conan year one" storyline. Death covered in Gold : (The title is actually a typo; it was meant to be "death carved in gold", according to Roy). This is clearly an early tale, which I would put a few months after Rogues in the House (Conan the barbarian #11). Conan is still a young thief, said to be "late from Zamora and Corinthia" ( Rogues happens in Corinthia). It's apparently the first time Conan was in Ophir, so an early placement seems reasonable. Conan meets Jenna in this tale, and they refer to events from Conan #6 and Conan #11 as being relatively recent. Conan would be around 19-20 at the time, according to the Miller chronology. Flame and the Fiend : That's a direct follow-up to Conan's becoming hetman of the Kozaki, seen at the end of the Conan the barbarian and Savage Sword of Conan titles. So it's set between Savage Sword of Conan#235 and SSoC#4 ( Iron Shadows in the Moon). He's 28-29. No idea about Scarlet Sword! I haven't read it. Those miniseries did nothing for me, if I'm being honest. I bought a bunch of those mini-series a few years back, but didn't read most of them until recently. I agree, they were not very remarkable - even the ones by Roy Thomas. Due to COVID-19, there have not been too many issues of Conan published this year and those that have been were also not very remarkable. Still the undisputed worst offerings of Conan comics still has to be the 11 issue run of Conan in 1995-1996. I have been enjoying rereading old issues of CtB and SSoC reprinted in ongoing Omnibuses published Marvel - Hopefully the entire runs of both will make it to print. Also interesting are the two available volumes of Barbarian Life: A Literary Biography of Conan the Barbarian, by Roy Thomas, which he describes the back stories of the stories he wrote for Marvel. Hopefully, he will print volume 3 as promised. A funny fact I learned of is that Barry Windsor-Smith tricked Roy Thomas into incorporating the word "wank" into issue #24 of CtB. Apparently, some 40 years later Roy still bears Barry a minor grudge over this and claims that if Barry told him the sky were blue, that he would look outside to double check.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Dec 6, 2020 18:18:47 GMT -5
Welcome back, Polar Bear! I don't have all those limited series, but here's what I can say about a few of them: Lord of the Spiders : It features the characters from SSoC#207-210, a tale placed right after Conan left the Turanian army in his early 20's. Those events are referred to as occurring "several years ago". Roy's magazine Alter Ego says it's set ten years or so after "Tower of the Elephant", whoich means Conan would be around 27; that means this limited series would be placed during the "lost years" of the Roy Thomas interregnum on Conan the barbarian (that never-ending 27th year of the Cimmerian's life). Conan was back in Zamora for a little while during those days, so somewhere between the end of Jim Owsley's run and the start of the "Conan year one" storyline. Death covered in Gold : (The title is actually a typo; it was meant to be "death carved in gold", according to Roy). This is clearly an early tale, which I would put a few months after Rogues in the House (Conan the barbarian #11). Conan is still a young thief, said to be "late from Zamora and Corinthia" ( Rogues happens in Corinthia). It's apparently the first time Conan was in Ophir, so an early placement seems reasonable. Conan meets Jenna in this tale, and they refer to events from Conan #6 and Conan #11 as being relatively recent. Conan would be around 19-20 at the time, according to the Miller chronology. Flame and the Fiend : That's a direct follow-up to Conan's becoming hetman of the Kozaki, seen at the end of the Conan the barbarian and Savage Sword of Conan titles. So it's set between Savage Sword of Conan#235 and SSoC#4 ( Iron Shadows in the Moon). He's 28-29. No idea about Scarlet Sword! I haven't read it. Those miniseries did nothing for me, if I'm being honest. I bought a bunch of those mini-series a few years back, but didn't read most of them until recently. I agree, they were not very remarkable - even the ones by Roy Thomas. Due to COVID-19, there have not been too many issues of Conan published this year and those that have been were also not very remarkable. Still the undisputed worst offerings of Conan comics still has to be the 11 issue run of Conan in 1995-1996. I have been enjoying rereading old issues of CtB and SSoC reprinted in ongoing Omnibuses published Marvel - Hopefully the entire runs of both will make it to print. Also interesting are the two available volumes of Barbarian Life: A Literary Biography of Conan the Barbarian, by Roy Thomas, which he describes the back stories of the stories he wrote for Marvel. Hopefully, he will print volume 3 as promised. A funny fact I learned of is that Barry Windsor-Smith tricked Roy Thomas into incorporating the word "wank" into issue #24 of CtB. Apparently, some 40 years later Roy still bears Barry a minor grudge over this and claims that if Barry told him the sky were blue, that he would look outside to double check. Indeed! I think "wank" was edited to "wonk" in later reprints. That issue, CtB #24, also has a massive phallic-looking tower and BWS jokingly imagined the comic being described in comic book guides as the "giant penis issue". It's really a pity that Dark Horse!s revival of Conan fizzled out. Marvel's current version reminds me a lot of the rudderless 1980s, when Conan was just a sword-wielding hero fighting wizards, with very little by way of world-building or continuity. But at least we'll always have Paris (or Tarantia, as it were).
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Post by foxley on Dec 7, 2020 2:25:39 GMT -5
Similarly, I think they could use most of the James Bond book titles that have been used for movies and make new, more faithful adaptations. Apart from most of the Connery films and the Lazenby one, they really just took the titles and a few character names, they didn't make any attempt to use the story itself.
I love that there are novelizations of the movies of the novels The Spy Who Loved Me and Moonraker, because the films bear little (the latter) to no (the former) resemblance to their sources. The original TSWLM would never work as a film, though.
Fleming actually hated the TSWLM novel--regarding it as a failed experiment--and when he sold the film rights to the books, the deal actually stipulated that they could use the title but nothing else from the novel.
The novel itself almost unreadable. The best way to experience it is actually the James Bond newspaper strip adaptation. It keeps the main events and, by depicting them, it adds an edge of danger and excitement that is missing in the novel, where the heroine (who is narrating) does not really understand what is going on. And the comic strip format means we speared the heroine's inane narration.
Apologies for the detour. I now return you to you regularly scheduled Conan.
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