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Post by commond on Jan 7, 2023 17:02:43 GMT -5
Optic Nerve has been published over a long period of time (1991-2019), which has seen Tomine go through a lot of growth and change as an artist. I wasn't overly impressed by the early stories, but he starts to come into his own around the Summer Blonde collection of stories (Optic Nerve #5-8.) The thing I love about Tomine is that instead of ending his stories with a climax and resolution, he cuts them off at random points. It takes some serious storytelling chops to be able to do that successfully. He's changed his style a bit in recent years. He produced a multi-issue story arc called Shortcomings that marked the end of his "middle period", if you like, and his recent work has been a bit more cartoony with the odd autobiographical story included. I strongly recommend issues #5-11, but bear in mind that the characters are generally warts and all portrayals, and not intended to be eminently likeable.
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Post by arfetto on Jan 7, 2023 18:13:20 GMT -5
I hope to post a bit about some Adrian Tomine comics eventually, but for now I think I will post about a comic that writing-wise and style-wise may get on more than a few peoples' optic nerves haha. Today the '90s comic I read was
Team 7 issue 1 of 4 (1994) Story: Chuck Dixon Pencils: Aron Wiesenfeld Inks: Trevor Scott Letters: Bill Oakley Color: Monica Bennett Computer Colors and Production: Wildstorm Effects Assistant Editor: Sarah Becker Editor In Chief: Bill KaplanSince I read and enjoyed the Ellis/Raney Stormwatch comics at the end of last year, I figure I should check out some more Wildstorm stuff as I have large gaps in my Wildstorm reading. I've read Alan Moore/Travis Charest WildC.A.T.s and some of the earlier Jim Lee WildC.A.T.s stuff, the aforementioned Ellis/Raney Stormwatch run that leads into The Authority, and then I have some random issues of '90s stuff like Gen 13, Deathblow, Wetworks and Backlash, but I've never actually read sat down and read those particular titles and kind of just looked through them, which I will explain in a bit.
Team 7 seems like a good starting point for me to begin reading the Wildstorm Universe, as it takes place in the '70s as a sort of prequel story for various Wildstorm characters in the '90s (or at the time of their publication, "present day") and is only four issues long. But, I must admit the main reason I wanted to read Team 7 is for the artwork. Pencils are by Aron Wiesenfeld, an artist I have been a bit fascinated with ever since his work on Wolverine/Deathblow. I figure it would be fun to go back and read/watch as his art style changes over the course of the '90s, so I'm looking through my comic boxes and finding his stuff (and I will order what I am missing). He was never the most prolific comic artist and seems to have quit the comic book industry completely. In fact, he seems to now be quite an accomplished painter, which is cool. But I will always have a soft spot for his '90s comic art, and that is largely because of his Wolverine/Deathblow work (which I hope to make an entry about explaining why later).
Now, back to why I have so many '90s Wildstorm comics if I have not read much Wildstorm (and well, not just Wildstorm, but that is the focus of this post). The thing is, there was a particular time period in the 2000s to almost say, 2010, where I could find huge lots of comic boxes at a particular yearly yard sale, entire longboxes for cheap, like 25 cents a comic or less (everything unread). Basically I would buy this stuff from speculators who were getting out of the speculation market and just hoping to unload the boxes on some poor shmuck (me, glad to be of service haha, because I just like to read comics). Now, sometimes it would be entire runs of great stuff like Ostrander's Suicide Squad or The Spectre. But other times the longboxes would have like 20 copies of issue one of The Maxx (which I enjoy very much, but I don't need 20 copies of it haha) or 20 copies of Larry Stroman's Tribe issue one (though I enjoy Stroman's art). And then sometimes it would be a bunch of various '90s Wildstorm comics, like random issues of Wildcore or DV8. For me, being a fan of '80s and '90s comics, there is a lot of interesting stuff in those boxes. But I still have not read everything in them.
It turns out I didn't have all four issues of Team 7 (or if I did, they are in different longboxes), so I ordered the missing ones off ebay, and I have just finished reading issue one. But, now I have to drive somewhere so I will write the rest when I return home.
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Post by codystarbuck on Jan 7, 2023 19:08:40 GMT -5
Maybe it's just the way this site displays it; but, that image looks like the steroid freak in the front has two heads, both with pairs of hands, growing out of his right leg.
I'm sure Chuck Dixon has; but, I wonder if anyone at Image ever fired a gun? The founders, I mean, and their acolytes; I know Mike Grell has not only fired them, he's carried them to meetings with his publisher!
I always wanted to see one of the artists who drew all of that gear on a character actually try to carry the real equivalent and see how far they'd get. I spent a week at Camp Pendleton, running around carrying a web belt with two canteens, a flak jacket, helmet and an M-16A2 rifle; that was heavy enough. We weren't carrying ammo, first aid kit, entrenching tool, rations, knife, sidearm, grenades, field packs or any of the rest of the gear the average infantryman carried, not to mention ammo belts for machine gunners, a field radio, LAW rocket launcher or any of that kind of thing.
Try carrying this stuff, which they actually did, on D-Day....
(Warning, salty soldier talk.......)
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Post by berkley on Jan 7, 2023 22:51:35 GMT -5
Optic Nerve has been published over a long period of time (1991-2019), which has seen Tomine go through a lot of growth and change as an artist. I wasn't overly impressed by the early stories, but he starts to come into his own around the Summer Blonde collection of stories (Optic Nerve #5-8.) The thing I love about Tomine is that instead of ending his stories with a climax and resolution, he cuts them off at random points. It takes some serious storytelling chops to be able to do that successfully. He's changed his style a bit in recent years. He produced a multi-issue story arc called Shortcomings that marked the end of his "middle period", if you like, and his recent work has been a bit more cartoony with the odd autobiographical story included. I strongly recommend issues #5-11, but bear in mind that the characters are generally warts and all portrayals, and not intended to be eminently likeable.
Thanks, that helps. I checked my stack and it turns out the issue I have is #5, but I don't remember anything about the content at this point. Looking up the wiki article on the series, it seems that Summer Blonde has a high school setting, which is not an attraction for me - not that it would stop me from reading or watching something if I were motivated by other things. But since there's an alternative in this case, perhaps I'll start with the next collection, Shortcomings, if I decide to try anything of Tomine's.
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Post by arfetto on Jan 7, 2023 22:52:12 GMT -5
The script for most of Team 7 issue one could potentially be for a more realistic war comic, but the art is definitely '90s Image excess.
The comic starts off with a splash page of Team 7 jumping out of a helicopter and firing their huge Imagey guns before they touch the ground. This is followed by a double page spread of more gunfire (with sound effects like BAH-CHOOM) as they land amongst "the enemy". Then page four is only two panels and has many BRAKA BRAKA BRAKAs in panel one followed by an explosion in panel two. Followed by another explosion on the next page. Throughout the carnage, the script lets the reader know that this scene takes place in the '70s and these guys are on a mission to rescue some hostages. Where? It doesn't really matter, it's just somewhere, okay? Haha.
Wiesenfeld's art in this comic is decidedly '90s Image, as it should be for a '90s Image comic I suppose. The last panel here on this upcoming image I am about to post reminds me of Whilce Portacio (and in fact Portacio drew a variant cover for the issue), or at least the three front figures do...maybe with some Cyberforce-era Silvestri mixed in.
I am just trying to spot his influences, because Wiesenfeld as a comic artist is a bit of a chameleon, his style seems to change drastically from one comic series to another as he randomly shows up over the years in the '90s and some of the '00s. It is very interesting to see...well, for me, anyway. I love seeing his earlier work here after knowing him first from the 1996/1997 Deathblow and Wolverine series (which I incorrectly called Wolverine/Deathblow in my preceding post). Would I have been able to guess the art on that series and Team 7 were the work of the same artist? I am not sure. I like to think I could, but I wonder.
The story is mostly direct-to-VHS covert-ops special mission movie type stuff, which the Image guys seemed to like (or maybe they simply liked taking James Cameron's Aliens off of LV-426 and setting it on Earth). There's some shady government intrigue and some twists and turns, and lots and lots of shooting and knifing (even some eye-gouging), and through it all the art team keeps the background environments detailed and visible so it seems like the arcade game Elevator Action Returns (1994) has been turned into comic form:
As far as characterization, there is a little, but as of issue one not all of the Team 7 members have been named yet to the reader as far as I can tell. I will read the issue again to see. So far there is Lynch, who I recognize as the same Lynch from Gen 13.
There is Cole Cash, who will of course later become Grifter in WildC.A.T.s. There is a shifty marine named Calahan, who I know as a character from Gen 13 and his relation to some DV8 stuff. There is Chang, who should be related to a character from Gen 13. And there is Cray, the "steroid freak" as was mentioned above haha, who later becomes Deathblow:
The issue ends with a cliffhanger where it looks like Team 7 has been betrayed by their own government (which is foreshadowed throughout, there is an uneasy feeling to the entire issue).
Overall, I enjoyed it. I feel I've gotten my money's worth out of this issue, and I am going to give it another re-read to see if I can pick up any other Team 7 member names. I am not going to actually recommend it to anyone here though haha.
But if you are ever in the mood for comic book explosions and rubble and explosions again, Team 7 issue one has you covered for sure.
EDIT: Re-reading, there is also a character named Slayton in Team 7, who will later (chronologically) become Backlash.
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Post by arfetto on Jan 8, 2023 13:55:25 GMT -5
Today I read
Team 7 issue 2 (1994)
By issue two, the art style is evolving into something else (inks are now by "JD" and Scott Williams instead of issue 1's Trevor Scott, but also Wiesenfeld is changing up his pencils, though things are a bit rough at times) and the story becomes more substantial too. I still like issue one a lot for its bold spectacle (I think it was a good move to start with that type of "movie action" and keep the Image reading audience of the time invested), but issue two seems like it could have been put out by some other comic publisher rather than just flashy Image. The script is solid.
It turns out the trap that Team 7 was lured into by their own government at the end of issue one infects the group with psychic abilities (the "Gen-Factor") and now the agency man responsible for this experimental project, Miles Craven, wants to see what happens to the members next. And what happens next is generally not good.
Some of the members, like Chang, gain some pretty powerful psychic abilities right off and aren't feeling many negative effects: While others, like Cray, don't seem to show any power signs at all ("Everybody else goes Martian on me and I'm still the same." he says after tossing a chair through a window). He actually seems upset that he has "let his country down" by not receiving any abilities from the trap they tricked him into haha.
And then of course, a few Team 7 members go mad with power:
(the colors kind of mess up some feet here, I just wanted to mention it since this is '90s Image)
Or are in such bad pain from gaining these abilities that they can't control them (you can still see some Portacio influence in this panel):
Even though it is a four-issue series, there are letters about issue one in the back of this issue two. Apparently the plan is to have multiple four issue mini-series of Team 7 stories, but I am not sure if that pans out.
I am also not sure how issue 3 and 4 pan out, but overall I am pretty impressed with this comic so far.
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Post by arfetto on Jan 8, 2023 15:38:16 GMT -5
Today I also read:
Thunderstrike issue 3 (1993)
This issue is about Thunderstrike having to save someone he really doesn't want to save. The theme is pretty heavy.
A Punisher-style vigilante, Sangre, is taking out the people that harmed her son and other children. Thunderstrike has to protect her next target, a man who is the school district supervisor. The supervisor is going to be arrested for his crimes, but that is not good enough for Sangre.
This issue reminds me of a case that happened in 1993 where a mother did something to similar in real life (but to one target rather than a whole group).
Luckily, so things don't get too depressing, we still get that patented Masterson goofballness to add some levity.
It's fun to see Thunderstrike question the practicalities of crime fighting. Now that he is a street level hero, he has a lot to learn.
And after The Juggernaut situation from issue 2 turned out "okay", Masterson tries once again to solve things without violence:
In this case, he may have to actually hurt Sangre...except, again, the practicalities of crime fighting rear their head.
The closest title I can compare Thunderstrike to from the same time period is Quasar, except Quasar dealt with cosmic threats rather than Earth level ones and only had about a year or less left in its lifespan by 1993. I'd be interested to read more '90s superhero comics where the heroes are very thoughtful of their surroundings and actions, considering the repercussions. Maybe this is why I find Thunderstrike a refreshing comic to read even today.
I know some people don't like the type of super comic where the writer has the characters think so much, because it gets wordy with the thought balloons and I suppose makes it a bit of a slog for them (or they feel a superhero comic doesn't need to be bogged down by mundane realities because the superhero concept is inherently ridiculous). I get that, but there is still enough action in these comics, I would contend, even with all the thinking and navigating. I know the whole Morrison quote about not needing to know who pumps Batman's tires (Harold?) haha, but I still find superhero comics that try to work out the logistics of superheroing kind of fun.
Oh, I almost forgot, have some '90s fashion as Sif wears Masterson's stuff:
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Post by james on Jan 8, 2023 20:05:12 GMT -5
What baffles me is how many people think that the 90's comic book industry is an absolute dumpster fire and utterly refuse to touch it, especially when a lot of good stuff came out that era. Stuff like Marvel's New Warriors, Mark Waid's Flash, Peter David's Aquaman, Sam Keith's The Maxx, Alan Moore's 1963, Bongo Comics' Radioactive Man, Valiant Comics, and the Malibu Ultraverse
I don't refuse to touch it, it's just my least favourite decade and some of its icons like Rob Liefeld and McFarlane just don't do it for me.
I feel the same way. Even the titles I did enjoy Thunderbolt, Astro City I never felt the need to revisit, and in my opinion these were two classic titles from the 90s
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Post by Dizzy D on Jan 9, 2023 4:42:58 GMT -5
I quite liked the first Team 7 series as well, because at heart it's a relatively simple story: a group of soldiers get exposed to something that gives most of them superpowers and how the various characters deal with it (both the powers and the circumstances that lead to them getting the powers). So you have those that revel in the power, those that thing it's a handy tool in their arsenal and those that are very sceptical that this is a good thing. In within those groups you have the several motivations for the characters why they are in that camp. So even without all the Wildstorm backstory, you still have a pretty self-contained story that would work as non-Wildstorm property. The next two series were a huge disappointment, it was just filling in plot gaps, but no real story.
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Post by arfetto on Jan 9, 2023 15:45:21 GMT -5
I still have one issue left, but I agree with your impression. The mini is a solid story first, and building up Wildstorm backstory second. Even someone with no interest in Wildstorm could read it and understand it with zero knowledge of anything before or after (unless issue four changes that). The best part about it being a simple tale that could work just as well out of the Wildstorm Universe as in it, is that for me legitimizes Wildstorm more. "I just have to tell good stories!" as Jim Shooter used to say (paraphrased) in his '90s Defiant ads haha. That is the way to build interest (in my wishful thinking world haha). Now I am actually a bit curious about some of these characters. I am going to guess most are not well utilized in other '90s Wildstorm books though. But there is potential here, so that would be a shame if they are not. Well, I will find out for myself. Today the '90s comic I read was issue three of Team 7.
This may be my favorite issue so far.
A rift is growing amongst the group, as some of the members are finding their psychic powers to be a blast, like Dane (later of Wetworks) here: While others are not feeling so jolly. Lynch, for example, is starting to realize Craven set the entire thing up, and Cash is not taking kindly to the way teammate Fairchild is using his psychic powers to coerce kisses:
There is growing discontent.
Especially inside Cray. He is the only Team 7 member that so far has not exhibited any signs of psychic ability, and as such he is feeling obsolete.
Despite everything, the members of Team 7 (sans Cray) are sent on another mission.
And end up in a Coptic monastery...of sorts. Due to a disagreement with how things should play out in the "monastery" plus bad blood boiling between the two since issue two, Cash and Lynch have a bit of a psychic showdown: Visually, Wiesenfeld's art continues to "power up". Maybe he was exposed to the Gen-Factor too haha.
Maybe the Gen-Factor is also how all the '90s Wildstorm characters carry so much stuff on their bodies or in their pouches. It is a catch-all solution. Oh, and then the issue ends with Director Craven launching a nuke at Team 7 haha. Definitely a way to one-up the previous issues' cliffhangers. Entertaining stuff.
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Post by codystarbuck on Jan 9, 2023 22:49:36 GMT -5
This looks nothing like the 70s that I lived through; then again, I experienced the decade qualude and pot-free. Maybe it's what the "bad crowd" was up to, while I was watching Baretta and Battlestar Galactica.
Just about anything written by Chuck Dixon is at least going to be readable and generally entertaining (aside from political stuff); so, it has that going for it. The art style isn't my cup of tea, though it is definitely in the better grounded end of the general Image spectrum, of the period.
That last image makes me think Wiesenfeld discovered Geoff Darrow's stuff, from Hard-Boiled and tried to one up him with weapons all over people. At least his stuff looks like it could be functional, which puts him well ahead of Liefeld and some of the others, in the 90s, with the Lego Guns.
I have to say, Wildstorm had a better track record with readable 90s material than most of the other Image camps, for this kind of stuff. Still not my artistic cup of tea; but, it's a lot closer to my wheelhouse than any of Liefeld's stuff, most of Larson's, Silvestri's own stuff. Spawn had more interesting page designs; but the stories made my brain hurt, even with the guest writers.
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Post by arfetto on Jan 10, 2023 0:19:08 GMT -5
Good point about the Darrow influence, I definitely think you are correct there. By 1996/7, Wiesenfeld is doing the Deathblow and Wolverine series in the following style:
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Jan 10, 2023 8:50:02 GMT -5
I read quite a bit of Wildstorm but have not read any Team 7 though I had seen it, just really didn't know what it was about and so I passed on it. Image and it's various imprints were churning out a lot of stuff that was relatively all new characters so I was less inclined (on a budget) to take chances with a lot of their stuff. I am glad I discovered Wildcats early on in spinner rack at a book store. Thought the whole series stayed pretty solid throughout. It was quite obvious when Travis Charest left, but he's a hard act to follow. I also enjoyed the Wildcats/X-Men crossovers set in the golden, silver and modern age of comics. The golden age was with Wolverine and Zealot. It was set in either WW1 or WW2. It's been awhile. I just remember the Germans were the antagonists.
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Post by badwolf on Jan 10, 2023 16:13:25 GMT -5
I was really into Tomine's comics for a while. I think around the same time I was interested in slice-of-life prose fiction as well (as opposed to the genre stuff I normally read.) I'm not sure how much I'd be into either now.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jan 11, 2023 7:31:52 GMT -5
That has a very Akira vibe.
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