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Post by gothos on Oct 31, 2014 17:46:44 GMT -5
NOTE: I moved this discussion about the idea that we should have a political thread into a political thread. Made sense. -- shax _____________________________________________________________________________________________
The one thing I wish CC could take from the old CBR boards was a willingness to discuss political matters in some sub-forum.
I say that with full awareness that all political concerns, left and right, are incipient breeders of trolls. The main reason is that one's politics define whatever one deems best for oneself, and to some extent for the rest of society-- so emotional tantrums often hit the ground running.
Ninety-nine times out of a hundred, "political discussions" on CBR consisted of people ranting at each other or misrepresenting each other's arguments. Could this forum, or any forum, ever emulate only the one-in-a-hundred "good stuff?" Maybe not. I wish it was possible, though I can understand why it would be a major headache.
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Post by thwhtguardian on Oct 31, 2014 18:18:31 GMT -5
I don't see why you couldn't have a political discussion in the comm forum here.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Oct 31, 2014 20:54:58 GMT -5
The one thing I wish CC could take from the old CBR boards was a willingness to discuss political matters in some sub-forum. I say that with full awareness that all political concerns, left and right, are incipient breeders of trolls. The main reason is that one's politics define whatever one deems best for oneself, and to some extent for the rest of society-- so emotional tantrums often hit the ground running. Ninety-nine times out of a hundred, "political discussions" on CBR consisted of people ranting at each other or misrepresenting each other's arguments. Could this forum, or any forum, ever emulate only the one-in-a-hundred "good stuff?" Maybe not. I wish it was possible, though I can understand why it would be a major headache. I agree with thwhtguardian. Honestly, I've been wondering why no one has started one yet. Though our gun control debate in the Meanwhile section the other day was pretty fun.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2014 21:00:33 GMT -5
Drop dead, capitalist swine.
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Post by Cei-U! on Oct 31, 2014 23:17:57 GMT -5
I'm glad we *don't* discuss politics much here, not because I question our collective ability to discuss it in a mature, non-contentious manner but because this is my safe harbor from all that stuff. I get inundated with political talk every morning on Facebook. I don't need or want to have that be part of my CCF experience too.
Cei-U! I summon my two cents' worth!
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Oct 31, 2014 23:39:09 GMT -5
I'm glad we *don't* discuss politics much here, not because I question our collective ability to discuss it in a mature, non-contentious manner but because this is my safe harbor from all that stuff. I get inundated with political talk every morning on Facebook. I don't need or want to have that be part of my CCF experience too. Cei-U! I summon my two cents' worth! Well, if someone starts one, no one will force you to click on it
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Crimebuster
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Post by Crimebuster on Nov 1, 2014 1:47:10 GMT -5
I'm glad we *don't* discuss politics much here, not because I question our collective ability to discuss it in a mature, non-contentious manner but because this is my safe harbor from all that stuff. I get inundated with political talk every morning on Facebook. I don't need or want to have that be part of my CCF experience too. Cei-U! I summon my two cents' worth! Well, if someone starts one, no one will force you to click on it The Republicans will!!! Am I doing this right?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2014 9:36:13 GMT -5
Well, if someone starts one, no one will force you to click on it The Republicans will!!! Am I doing this right? Yes, you are. I'm sure we have Repubicans & people with comparable leanings here; odds favor it. Admittedly, people like me, Cei-U!, Prince Hal & plenty of others (apologies for those I'm leaving out; even less awake than usual in the a.m., having been up for an hour or so in the middle of the night to take meds, etc., after conking out too early to do last at the usual time last night) make no secret of our leftist orientations, so those with contrary viewpoints might well feel reluctant to express them ... ... but they shouldn't, of course. We need their names for when the revolu- ... uh, I mean, civil discourse on such matters would be welcome, I like to think, as shax indicates above. Besides, some of my best friends, IRL & online both, are jackbooted fas- ... uh, that, is, staunch conservatives.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 1, 2014 9:41:54 GMT -5
I think clinging to one side or the other breeds intractability. We live in an age now where you customize your news feed to only tell you things you agree with. It's so easy to get stuck in one point of view.
That's why I oppose a label of any kind. I'm very "left" on some things, very anti "left" on others, somewhat "right" on some things, and generally open minded and willing to open up ALL of my opinions to scrutiny so that I can be persuaded to make strong choices. I think I know my stance on a lot of issues, but I can't be 100% sure I'm right. Rather than expending my energy adamantly defending the opinion my like-minded friends tell me I should espouse, I'd rather expend that energy talking to people who DON'T think the same way I do and working to understand their point of view so that I'll understand my own better.
I think half the problem in America is people walking around calling themselves "left," "right," "liberal," or "conservative." Why can't we have people who believe in strong unions but not abortions? Why can't we have people who love guns and hate wealth inequality?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2014 9:52:25 GMT -5
Possible appearances to the contrary, like shax I don't exactly toe the doctrinaire leftist line. Most obvious example of that is abortion, the hot-buttonest of hot-button issues. I'll leave it at that for now -- not, again, awake enough to even aspire to the level of articulation the subject demands.
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Nov 1, 2014 10:01:27 GMT -5
I think I've been accused of both labels depending on what the subject of debate is. On two of the three usual hot topics I think I'm accused of being conservative. The other usually lands me a sinner in gods eyes and a bleeding heart liberal.
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Post by Randle-El on Nov 1, 2014 10:42:50 GMT -5
I've engaged in online discussions dealing with both politics and religion, and my general take-away from it is that it's extremely difficult (though not impossible) to have thoughtful discussions on those topics. As Shax mentioned, a lot of such discussion these days tend to be more preaching to the choir and "Amen"-shouting than anything else, and it just causes people to dig their heels in rather than intelligently engage opposing views. Or if you have opposing views, you may feel unwelcome in expressing them. It doesn't help that electronic mediums such as chat, e-mail, and social media make it even harder to parse people's emotions and tone, and therefore easily can cause us to read harshness or ill intent into messages when none was intended. My experience has been that keeping the conversation elevated often requires one to bend over backwards to be more civil than one would ordinarily be, simply to offset the inherent limitations of the electronic medium.
Then again, a lot of it may simply be us mirroring the people we vote into office, who don't seem to be any more capable of having respectful debate in real life than we do online.
I may stop by a political thread from time-to-time if everyone can play nice. Then again, I live in the Washington D.C. area where people talk about politics all the time, so it's not like I have a tremendous lack of political talk.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2014 10:51:33 GMT -5
I lost many friends over the discussion of politics and having said that - I will exercise my beliefs through careful voting process and that's it. I don't tell anyone if I'm liberal, moderate, conservative, democrat, republican, and the only thing that I tell them ... is two words!
Concerned Independent ... that's my 2 cents worth in this discussion!
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Nov 1, 2014 12:13:36 GMT -5
Please alert me whenever someone's actual position is changed by the idealogical posturing and repiticious talking points that usually populate these threads. After growing up as a left-wing hippie McGovern volunteer and later adopting some mid-1980s conservative viewpoints, I've only come to the conclusion that both American political parties suck and all politicians should be one term and then dismissed with a thank you note
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Post by Deleted on Nov 1, 2014 12:18:26 GMT -5
I've only come to the conclusion that both American political parties suck and all politicians should be one term and then dismissed with a thank you note Fascist. That's one term too many. I know it, you know it & the American people know it.
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