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Post by codystarbuck on Aug 20, 2024 21:08:33 GMT -5
The Musee de la Civilisation, in Quebec City, Quebec, has an exhibition of pro wrestling, with installations covering from the barnstorming days through the modern era, with personal memorabilia lent to the exhibition. It features hologram displays of matches and some cool installations, as noted by Greg Oliver, at Slam Wrestling......Several famous wrestlers who worked in Montreal and Quebec have appeared there, including Gilles "The Fish" Poisson, Pierre Carl Oulette and ick Martel....who has my hairline, now......   Rick's looking much thinner than his wrestling days; but, look at the size of his paws! My grandfather, a farmer, had hands like that. |
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Post by driver1980 on Aug 21, 2024 4:05:31 GMT -5
Last night’s viewing:  Crush vs. BerzerkerThis is around 5-6 minutes long. Lots of power moves. All convincing. Crush is brutal in this one, and Berzerker sells well. I feel many power guys are underrated and overlooekd by workrate advocates like Meltzer. Crush gets the pin to end a fun bout. DIY with The BushwhackersIt’s a fun segment. I give it 5 and 3/4 stars. Earthquake vs. Repo ManThis is also on the WrestleFest ‘93 tape. As a glorified squash match, it’s fun. Repo Man gets little offense in, ‘Quake wins via pinfall after destroying Repo Man with the vertical splash. Cooking with YokozunaBasically, Yokozuna gorges himself. This is an overlong segment, and I see no real reason why it had to be included here. WWF Intercontinental Champion Bret Hart vs. Shawn Michaels (Ladder match)While it lacks the high spots of later ladder matches (not a bad thing), and can’t compare to the two Razor/Shawn ladder matches, this one is very good, and Bret and Shawn bring their usual A-game. It has stood the test of time, and is possibly the bout of the tape. WWF Champion Bret Hart vs. KamalaI’m pretty sure this was on another tape. It’s okay, but the highlight is probably Kamala accidentally splashing Dr. Harvey Wippleman. Bret wins via pinfall. WWF Champion Ric Flair vs. Bret HartI don’t think this bout is necessarily as great as people have said, and I’m not convinced Bret and Flair ever had the best chemistry. Still, it’s a milestone, given Bret wins his first world championship here, and it does feature two talented guys doing their best, even if I don’t believe they worked that well together. The Undertaker vs. Razor RamonThere are three different Ramon/Taker matches on various Coliseum tapes. Thank goodness they’re not recycling bouts. However, none of the bouts end conclusively, here we have Taker winning by count out. SummaryI could not recommend acquriing this tape. It’s uneven. The segments are rather pointless. Even the “main event” style bouts aren’t really as great as they could have been, I feel. One to avoid. |
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Post by driver1980 on Aug 21, 2024 7:18:10 GMT -5
The Musee de la Civilisation, in Quebec City, Quebec, has an exhibition of pro wrestling, with installations covering from the barnstorming days through the modern era, with personal memorabilia lent to the exhibition. It features hologram displays of matches and some cool installations, as noted by Greg Oliver, at Slam Wrestling......Several famous wrestlers who worked in Montreal and Quebec have appeared there, including Gilles "The Fish" Poisson, Pierre Carl Oulette and ick Martel....who has my hairline, now...... Rick's looking much thinner than his wrestling days; but, look at the size of his paws! My grandfather, a farmer, had hands like that. Bless him. Loved Martel’s work. Quite a few Warrior pics in that glass case, eh? |
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Post by codystarbuck on Aug 21, 2024 10:36:47 GMT -5
The Musee de la Civilisation, in Quebec City, Quebec, has an exhibition of pro wrestling, with installations covering from the barnstorming days through the modern era, with personal memorabilia lent to the exhibition. It features hologram displays of matches and some cool installations, as noted by Greg Oliver, at Slam Wrestling......Several famous wrestlers who worked in Montreal and Quebec have appeared there, including Gilles "The Fish" Poisson, Pierre Carl Oulette and ick Martel....who has my hairline, now...... Rick's looking much thinner than his wrestling days; but, look at the size of his paws! My grandfather, a farmer, had hands like that. Bless him. Loved Martel’s work. Quite a few Warrior pics in that glass case, eh? Well, you had to have at least some heels represented! |
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Post by commond on Aug 21, 2024 15:44:11 GMT -5
Martel looks unrecognizable even from a few years ago.
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Post by driver1980 on Aug 21, 2024 17:22:57 GMT -5
I had no idea of the genesis of the MITB concept until I read this in the latest issue of WrestleTalk (a publication that, quite frankly, is filled with typos and inaccuracies at times):  |
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Post by codystarbuck on Aug 21, 2024 18:38:59 GMT -5
Martel looks unrecognizable even from a few years ago. Which, given Kevin Sullivan's recent issues, does make me wonder, a bit, if he has had any health issues. He does seem rather thin in the face, compared to even his Kayfabe Commentaries WWF Timeline 1981 interview, which was, what, about 10 years ago? Maybe its the angle in the photo, or the lighting or just age. Rick is wearing a ball cap in the Timeline interview, so maybe he was thinning then. I still recall seeing a photo of Tully Blanchard, with his father, from a fanfest, on Slam Wrestling and was shocked at how much Tully kind of looked like my dad. I hadn't seen an image of him since he wrestled a bit for an indy in South Carolina. |
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Post by Ricky Jackson on Aug 21, 2024 18:40:03 GMT -5
That early idea actually sounds pretty neat, but definitely un-WWE/un-Vince like, so you can understand why it wasn't used. The MITB concept was interesting the first time around, but once it became an annual thing it quickly became stale, like most WWE booking during the late-Vince era. I'm generally not a fan of multi-wrestler matches, and don't get me started on the tedious setting up of ladders (and tables) that sucks any feeling of chaos or danger out of these matches
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Post by driver1980 on Aug 21, 2024 19:03:00 GMT -5
That early idea actually sounds pretty neat, but definitely un-WWE/un-Vince like, so you can understand why it wasn't used. The MITB concept was interesting the first time around, but once it became an annual thing it quickly became stale, like most WWE booking during the late-Vince era. I'm generally not a fan of multi-wrestler matches, and don't get me started on the tedious setting up of ladders (and tables) that sucks any feeling of chaos or danger out of these matches I’m not the biggest fan of multi-wrestler matches, either. With MITB, I wish the rules could be ladders only. As someone once said, adding tables and chairs is like putting a hat on a hat - or gravy on gravy. Less is often more. |
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Post by driver1980 on Aug 22, 2024 8:13:43 GMT -5
Last night’s viewing:  Hulk Hogan vs. The UndertakerFrom the summer of 1991, we get a televised bout between Hogan and ‘Taker. Odd how Survivor Series 1991 was presented as their first meeting. This is under 5 minutes, and is fairly entertaining. Surprisingly, we see a pinfall victory - that surprised me at the time - as Hogan rolls up Undertaker after interference from Paul Bearer backfires. Hulk Hogan vs. Randy SavageFrom Paris, France, circa 1989. It’s on at least 2 other tapes, I’m sure (more recycling, Coliseum Video). Still, it’s the best bout they ever had (IMO), and we see Hogan pin Savage - obviously! Definitely a good match to have on the tape. Suburban Commando adDidn’t this movie win 8 Oscars? And make trillions around the world? Anyway, I suppose clips were useful in the pre-YouTube days. Hulk Hogan vs. Stan HansenWow. This was the first Hogan match I saw where he was utilising moves not seen on American soil. It is incredibly heated. Hogan unveils moves like the back suplex. And he moves very fast. As this took place in Japan (Tokyo Dome) - circa 1990 - that was what fans expected of Hogan. This is the perfect match to show that Hogan could wrestle, he just didn’t need to on WWF programming. And we see a Hogan win with not the mighty legdrop of doom, but the axe bomber. Match of the tape! Hulk Hogan vs. King Kong Bundy (WM II)Well done, Coliseum. The recycling continues. Didn’t you think us fans already owned the WM II tape? Still, both guys are very spirited, Bundy is presented as a legitimate threat, and it’s all very believable. As you all know, Hogan wins by escaping the cage. (I really do prefer cage bouts where pinfalls and submissions count) Hogan visits the troopsThere’s brief footage of Hogan visiting the US military troops. What can I say about that? I know many found the Gulf War angle offensive. Hulk Hogan vs. Gen. AdnanI’m not sure I can review a match that ends with a Hogan win via DQ after about a minute. It’s a glorified angle to set up WM VII. Hulk Hogan vs. Sgt. Slaughter (WM VII)What’s with the recycling? These tapes at times could and should have shown us some SNME bouts at least (or the various Hogan/Piper bouts that never seemed to show up on tapes). We already owned the WM VII tape. Regardless of my feelings about that, this is a goodwill bout with good chemistry between the Hulkster and Slaughter, ending with Hogan getting the win for himself and the United States after the legdrop of doom. Hulk Hogan & Hacksaw Jim Duggan vs. Sgt. Slaughter & Col. MustafaIt’s all feeling very familiar now, as if the tape should have been called “The Hogan-Slaughter Feud”. This is a reasonably entertaining tag bout which sees Hulkster get the win for his team after pinning Mustafa - after a lot of shenanigans and interference from Gen. Adnan. Hogan would also team with Warrior to battle Undertaker, Sgt. Slaughter & Gen. Adnan. And then there was the SummerSlam ‘91 main event. Quite honestly, they went to the well once too often, and by SummerSlam ‘91, I was exhausted and fed up with the Hogan/Slaughter feud. SummaryA case could be made that the novelty of Hogan/Stan Hansen makes this tape a worthwhile purchase, and for those that didn’t own the WM II and WM VII tapes, then I guess it presents good value for money. It’s just another case of Greenpeace Video…erm, I mean Coliseum Video recycling bouts instead of giving us something new (in the 90s, I was desperate to see some Hogan/Piper bouts on tape). However, overall, it’s a solid tape, and one of the better Hogan releases. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Aug 22, 2024 13:38:25 GMT -5
Hogan in the US you can keep (well, WWF and WCW....I haven't seen many AWA matches with him); but, Hogan in Japan was a different story. After a couple of months of watching his matches in the WWF, I could pretty much predict when his comeback would come ad when the finish was about to occur. Flair repeated his matches; but, had more variety in that match and his opponents were mostly great workers, rather than monsters doing kick-punch-slam routines. I know it worked on the larger stage and with the younger audience; but I found it boring and predictable. It seemed exciting, at the beginning; but familiarity bred contempt.
I much preferred watching other guys work, like Savage and Dibiase, or Jake Roberts or Rick Rude, or Steamboat and Orndorff. They didn't necessarily do the same stuff they did in NWA and AWA (and other) promotions; but, they had more variety to their work.
Even seeing the earlier pre-expansion WWF, in 1982, didn't make me much of a fan of their style of wrestling, apart from a few key guys. I first saw the MSG matches, on USA Network, before they had the regular shows, and they were mostly that same kick-punch-slam, broader style. It played better to the bigger arenas of the Northeast, where crowds were sat farther back; but I found it rather dull. The exceptions were the guys who had more energy in their work, like Bob Backlund and Jimmy Snuka and Pedro Morales, depending on his opponent. Tiger Mask was an amazing diversion, in an otherwise boring card. Otherwise, watching Tony Garea and Swede Hanson go at it, compared to the likes of Randy Savage and Ronnie Garvin battling it out, was just worlds apart.
That style differentiation is a lot of what killed later pro wrestling for me, as you lost that variety you used to get from other organizations. Once everyone wanted to be the WWF, on a lower budget, it fell apart, for me. Even when WCW was copying them, they still had something different, like the cruiserweights/luchadors, or exciting tag team action or just a particular crew, at the time. With early cable, especially when I got to Athens and could watch the Superstars of Wrestling bloc, you could see Southern Wrestling, on WTBS, AWA wrestling, Mid-South (if you were lucky), Memphis, World Class, maybe Continental or Florida, clips from Puerto Rico and Japan. Each had their own stylistic touches.
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Post by driver1980 on Aug 23, 2024 4:34:57 GMT -5
Dream card (I don’t know who to attribute this to):  |
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Post by commond on Aug 23, 2024 6:58:27 GMT -5
I'm trying to think if those are the matchups I'd actually want to see.
I think I'd go with:
Hulk Hogan vs. Ric Flair
Road Warriors vs. Demolition
Randy Savage vs. Sting
Strike Force vs. Tully Blanchard & Arn Anderson
The Rockers vs. Rock 'n' Roll Express
Dusty Rhodes vs. Ric Rude
Jake Roberts vs Ronnie Garvin
Ted DiBiase vs. Barry Windham
That leaves a ton of wrestlers off the card, which makes me wonder if they'd have a battle royal.
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Post by dbutler69 on Aug 23, 2024 8:13:36 GMT -5
You know, on rankings, although the PWI family of magazines weren’t beholden to the WWF, there was at least a logic (of sorts) to their rankings, which did seem to be based on merit - well, as much merit as a kayfabe wrestling world can have. That reminds me, post-Attitude Era, I used to get a bit irked when a wrestler like Triple H would just come out and say to another wrestler, “You and me - in the ring, next week on Raw!” And that was that, JR and the King would close with, “Next week, Triple H and Maven in the main event.” I much preferred pre-Attitude logic, e.g. Jack Tunney having to make announcements, or commentators saying things like, “The world champion has signed an open contract, which means anyone can have a shot.” Again, it’s no bad thing to *try* and treat wrestling like a real sport. So when you had commentary regarding “open contracts” and the like, at least it made sense when, say, Repo Man got a world title shot, or something such as Tatanka getting an IC title shot because of his undefeated streak. So, in the case of the KOTR, at least pay lip service as to why Roadie and Doink are high in the rankings, make up some logic! I agree that the earlier era, where wrestlers didn't just say "next week" and so it was, with Tunney sometimes getting involved to make the matches happen, and mention of a contract needing to be signed, definitely seemed more real than what they started doing later. At least there was a veneer of authenticity then. I also remember little details like Gorilla Monsoon talking about how the winner's share of the purse was so much larger than the lower's share (usually 2X but sometimes, depending upon the contract, it could be winner take all) really did make things seem more real and made the stakes of the match higher. And yes, the open contracts and other things you mentioned. It seems like around 1994ish they stopped paying attention to these details and became focused more on just the entertainment aspect rather than the wrestling or the authenticity. At the point I'm in right now in WWF (1995) the announcers hardly ever discuss the actual wrestling match we're watching (WCW is much better than them in this regard) usually talking about current events, celebrity gossip, or other wrestlers not even involved in the match in progress. They also used to actually mention the name of the referee on occasion but at this point they don't bother with that anymore. They also hardly ever show replays any more. Too busy showing other stupid things. |
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Post by driver1980 on Aug 23, 2024 10:44:44 GMT -5
A veneer of authenticity is the right term, my friend. Yes, talk about the winner’s share of the purse and all that added to the reality.
One thing I hated about later stuff was the UTTER STUPIDITY of heel wrestlers discussing their plans in front of a camera that they could not miss . For example, in 2005, Batista, then with Evolution, was almost hit by a mystery driver. His Evolution colleagues Triple H and Ric Flair were behind it, although JBL, who had had issues with Batista, was number one suspect. Anyway, Triple H and Flair, in the locker room, discussed their attempt on Batista during an episode of Raw. For all the world to see. They had to know Batista would find out - yet they were surprised when he turned babyface on them weeks later.
I felt like writing to the WWF writers and saying, “Do you guys, and the heels, not know that such footage would have been recorded by a guy or two holding big camera equipment?”
At least back in the day, someone like Brutus Beefcake would put on a mask and attack Hogan, all part of the charade. Post-Attitude, no heel thought or acted logically at times.
There was an episode of Raw where Triple H forced Jim Ross to have a match with him (no doubt more of Vince McMahon having fun at Ross’ expense). Again, at the time, I thought, ‘What matchmaking powers does Triple H have?’ By that logic, the lowest-ranked wrestler could have appeared on the ramp and said, “Triple H, I want a shot at your world championship next week!”
A little logic matters. I know some fans were clamouring for a Hogan/Warrior rematch after WM VI, but Jack Tunney refused to sanction such a rematch because of concerns that both men might end up hurting each other due to their intensity and past conflict. It may sound silly, but it made sense. However, given later WWE logic, Warrior should just have shown up on WWF Superstars and demanded a match.
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