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Post by dbutler69 on Mar 19, 2024 15:52:12 GMT -5
There are some good TV matches on Worldwide and Saturday Night if you do a little cherry picking. Yeah, I've been watching Saturday Night on Peacock (I'm on 1993 now), and the overall quality of the wrestling is pretty good. It compares favorably to contemporary WWF, though there are some too long rest holds sometimes.
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 19, 2024 16:10:12 GMT -5
Russo was going about the ‘casual fans’ again, as if bringing back the lapsed fan who MAY tune into WM XL matters. Does this guy ever consider the long-term fan? Can’t this guy find another profession: The business did not choose him. He couldn’t stop writing to the WWF, and Linda McMahon gave him a job (assuming he’s accurate about that). Is this guy looking for a job? Woe betide any organisation who hires him in 2024.
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 20, 2024 4:06:08 GMT -5
Thirty years ago today, WrestleMania X aired on PPV, taking place at MSG: “McMahon Math” struck for the first time here: they presented this as the tenth anniversary rather than the tenth event. They did the bizarre maths again, such as in 2004, 2009, etc. Any normal person knew this took place nine years after the inaugural event. At the time, I was absolutely sure Hulk Hogan would be in the card. How could he not be? I didn’t expect him at WM IX, but he showed up. Well, he didn’t. And it felt quite surreal. At the time, I saw no reports of any attempts by the WWF to reach out to Hogan, so perhaps they’d finally put him behind them at that point. The dark match featured The Buswhackers vs. The Heavenly Bodies. Poor old Luke and Butch were often not on a card, or in a dark match (two years earlier, they’d had a dark match against the Beverly Brothers at WM VIII). Bret Hart and Owen Hart began the main card, in a stellar 20-minute match which some people still talk about today. A great way to start the card. Doink and Dink took on Bam Bam Bigelow and Luna Vachon in a short match that probably sent some people home happy. I don’t mind a bit of comedy in wrestling. Randy Savage, in his final WM match, battled Crush in a Falls Count Anywhere match. This was reasonable, but I expected a lot more, given the participants involved and the gimmick. Alundra Blayze defended the WWF Women’s Championship against Leilani Kai. Sadly, this was an afterthought, which summed up the WWF’s approach to the women’s ‘division’ at the time. The Quebecers defended the WWF Tag Team Championship against Men on a Mission in a fun bout. Yokozuna defended the WWF Championship against Lex Luger, with special referee Mr. Perfect, the winner going against Bret Hart later that night. This near-15 minute match was boring, it felt like it lasted forever. Yokozuna won after Perfect disqualified Luger for putting his hands on him. This was supposed to lead to a feud between Luger and Perfect, but Perfect left shortly afterwards due to back issues, which led him to cash in his Lloyds of London insurance policy. In a complete waste of airtime, Earthquake squashed Adam Bomb in 35 seconds. The two had a slightly longer match later on, which was shown on the Coliseum Video release Paul Bearer’s Hits from the Crypt. Razor Ramon defended his Intercontinental Championship against Shawn Michaels in a Ladder match. This one has stood the test of time well, and is more psychological and restrained than the “bring everything but the kitchen sink” ladder matches of later years. In the main event, which lasted for 10:38, Bret Hart regained the WWF Championship from Yokozuna, with guest referee Roddy Piper. The match was a spirited one, and it sent the fans home happy, possibly eliminating any bad feelings about the ending of WM IX. Summary: It was odd not to see Hogan on the card, and it felt wrong that The Undertaker was absent. However, this had an enthusiastic atmosphere about it, and with the exception of the womens’ bout, the Earthquake/Bomb bout, and the boring Luger/Yokozuna bout, everything else was great, and it set up a lot of feuds, which took place on the WrestleMania Revenge Tour (great marketing there, WWF). This is one of the better WM events.
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 20, 2024 4:23:24 GMT -5
Thirty years ago today, Sting defeated Vader to win the WCW European Cup, in Hamburg, Germany. In the previous rounds, Sting had defeated Kane, Ron Simmons, and Steve Austin. This is the same tournament in which Cactus Jack had his right ear ripped off while wrestling Vader, after a hangman spot in the ropes went wrong. Thankfully, he didn’t lose the ear permanently. Details of the tournament are here: www.cagematch.net/?id=26&nr=171&page=2Oh, and Happy 65th Birthday to Sting!
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 21, 2024 7:37:41 GMT -5
From WrestleTalk:
Khan needs to either release Perry or bring him back. But the current situation does not serve Perry or AEW.
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Post by codystarbuck on Mar 21, 2024 12:10:44 GMT -5
From WrestleTalk: Khan needs to either release Perry or bring him back. But the current situation does not serve Perry or AEW. Assuming the first line is true, then he should have fired him, as well as Punk. By all accounts, Perry instigated the whole thing and has been a pain-in-the-ass since the company started. It underlines how little control Khan exercises over his own company. I would say it is time to grow up and be the boss, but it is next to impossible for a weak leader to suddenly try to instill discipline and be successful, as no one respects him enough to respond. It's easier to start out being a hard case and ease off, then start out weak and try to tighten things up. Regardless, you can't be "one of the boys."
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 21, 2024 14:19:45 GMT -5
I saw a piece about “demotions” and WWF/WWE wrestlers being way down the card in between WrestleMania PPVs. The following examples were given:
* King Kong Buddy challenges for the WWF World Title at WM II, but is in a six-man tag at WM III, involving him, Little Tokyo and Lord Littlebrook vs Hillbilly Jim, Haiti Kid and Little Beaver.
* Demolition winning their third tag team title at WM VI, but losing a glorified squash match to Tenryu and Kitao at WM VII.
* Lex Luger challenges Yokozuna for the WWF Championship at WM X, but is part of an opening tag match at WM XI (Allied Powers vs. Jacob and Eli Blu).
* Stone Cold Steve Austin battles The Rock in the main event of WM XVII, but is in a glorified throwaway match against Scott Hall at WM X8 (why didn’t they use a proper Roman numeral that year?
I bet there are many examples - not just for WM, but for other PPVs (and other promotions).
For me, Lex Luger at SummerSlam is an interesting one: challenges for the WWF Championship in 1993, battles Tatanka in 1994 over who has joined the Million Dollar Corporation, then doesn’t wrestle at the 1995 event, instead doing a run-in during the Diesel/King Mabel bout.
You could argue the reverse. Who got “promoted”, so to speak? Ultimate Warrior loses the I-C Championship to Rude at WM V, but defeats Hulk Hogan for the WWF Title at WM VI.
On a not-entirely-unrelated note, what of Tito Santana? Wins at the inaugural WrestleMania, in the opening match against The Executioner, but loses at II, III, IV, V, VI, VII, and VIII. Comes full circle at IX, albeit in a dark match (beating Papa Shango).
I’m sure there are plenty of WCW examples, too. Sting winning the NWA World Championship at Great American Bash ‘90, but battling Nikita Koloff in a Russian Chain Match at Great American Bash ‘91 seems like a bit of a “demotion”.
On a final note, someone elsewhere joked about how Lawrence Taylor main evented WM XI, but didn’t even make the card of WM XII!
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Post by dbutler69 on Mar 21, 2024 15:19:04 GMT -5
I watched Battlebowl 1993.
The Battlebowl used to be part of Starrcade, but then WCW realized that there was a month on the calendar without a WCW PPV, so they gave this its own separate PPV.
The rules are that 16 tag teams are randomly drawn from a hopper (by Gene Okerlund and Fifi) for 8 tag team matches. The 8 winning teams from those matches will all qualify for a 16 man battle royal, with the winner being the Battlebowl champ and getting a Superbowl-style piece of bling. These drawings are suppose to be random but it seems to almost always (last year it was every team) team up a face with a heel.
The first tag match is Cactus Jack & Vader (w. Harley Race) v. Kane (from Harlem Heat, AKA Stevie Ray) & Charlie Norris. Jack & Vader still have a hot feud going, so they start beating on each other before the match starts until Race finally convinces them to work together. Vader wins it for his team with a sloppy powerbomb (he stumbled and dropped Norris, but it maybe have been Norris’s fault). It was pretty obvious who was going to win this match. The match itself was so-so. Nothing great, but not offensively bad either.
Next is Paul Roma & Erik Watts v. Johnny B. Badd & Brian Knobbs (of the Nasty Boys, with Missy Hyatt). We actually have two faces teamed together in Roma and Watts. Knobbs wins it for his team (no surprise) by rolling through a bodypress and grabbing Watts’s tights. Again, this match, like the first one, wasn’t anything special. However, as the first match had some good storytelling between the Vader/Jack team, so this one did with the Knobbs/Badd team (Badd taking offense to Knobbs’s underhanded tactics during the match).
Next match is The Shockmaster & Paul Orndorff v. Ricky Steamboat & Lord Steven Regal. We get another team made up of guys involved in a feud (Steamboat & Regal) – what are the odds? Anyway, this match did have some good storytelling and some amusing moments. The team of Orndorff & Shockmaster win (the first result of the night that actually surprised me – why put over the Shockmaster??) when Regal is about to clobber his opponent, but Steamboat (his own partner, mind you) grabs the umbrella from him, disgusted at this attempt at cheating, and hits his own partner with it (maybe accidentally but it looked intentional to me – either way it makes Steamboat look like a dummy) and Shockmaster flops on the fallen Regal for the pin. Steamboat came across as either very upright or very dumb, and I kinda think it was more of the latter than the former. Anyway, this was a fun match.
As an aside, Shockmaster got a “Paula” chant started during the match, to aggravate his own teammate, which makes no sense.
Next match is Awesome Kong & The Equalizer v. King Kong & Dustin Rhodes. Ugh. Dustin Rhodes and 3 big guys who are absolutely awful. Also, all three guys would as soon as clobber Rhodes as look at him, so he’s in a difficult position. The Kings are the first tag team to be on opposite sides. Unfortunately, nobody cares about these guys, so that angle goes nowhere, though there was one cute spot where King Kong was tagged in by Dustin to face Awesome Kong, then immediately tagged Dustin back in because he didn’t want to face his partner. Anyway, there’s chaos in the ring (as with most WCW tag team matches) when Dustin bulldogs Awesome Kong, and he and King Kong advance. No surprise there. Not a good match. I’ll just leave it at that. This was boring and the crowd didn’t care
We’re only halfway through these things.
Next match is Sting & Jerry Sags v. Ron Simmons & Keith Cole. Gee, I wonder who’s going to win this one. This was a decent match, though too much stalling. Anyway, Sting & Sags win when Sting gives Keith Cole the Stinger Splash, then, he’s about to go for his finisher, but Sags taps Sting on the shoulder (which I guess counts as a tag) then gives Keith Cole the elbow off the top rope (his finisher) then pins Cole. After the match, Ron Simmons, furious with Cole’s underperformance, attacks him. So it looks like we’ve got a heel turn for Simmons.
Next match is Stunning Steve Austin & Ric Flair v. Maxx Payne & 2 Cold Scorpio. Again, not much suspense as to who is going to win. Flair/Austin win when Payne misses a corner charge (why do guys even attempt a corner charge???) and Flair slaps the figure four on him. Overall, this was a good match with good storytelling and psychology. It started with a fast, exciting exchange between Austin and Scorpio, then slowed down quite a bit, and the heat segment on Scorpio later on lasted a bit too long, but still a good match.
Ric Flair, of all people, stopped his teammate Steve Austin from cheating. This theme of the face on the team being disgusted by the cheating of his heel teammate is getting used too often in this PPV.
Next match is Ravishing Rick Rude & Shanghai Pierce v. Marcus Alexander Bagwell & Tex Slazenger. Pierce and Slazenger are a tag team, and early in the bout they refuse to fight each other (such loyalty from heels? How touching. Not like comic book supervillains who are all too glad to turn on each other.) but they do finally go at it hammer and tongs towards the end of the match. Tex Slazenger has such a large following (though I could never figure out why) that the crowd cheers for him and perhaps a face turn wouldn’t have been out of place. Rude tags in without Tex even knowing and delivers the Rude Awakening, so Rude and Pierce advance to Battlebowl. Overall, this match was too long and the heat segment on Bagwell lasted way too long, making this match another mediocre one, though Rude did have a couple of really cool moves. He did something like a vertical suplex but rather than falling backwards himself with Bagwell, he just dropped him. He had another move that looked like it would be a suplex but then he just dropped Bagwell on his face. Those moves looked devastating and aren’t things you see every day. After the match, Pierce and Slazenger make amends then beat on the prostrate Bagwell while Rude walks back to the locker room.
I have to point out that, as Okerlund and Fifi are on camera after each match to draw names for the next match, Okerlund is acting like a total pervert. I guess that’s the running gag for the night. That sort of talk wouldn’t happen on WWF – yet.
Also, at some point in this telecast, Ric Flair provided Vader and Race with a contract, challenging him to a title match at Starrcade, with the stipulation that if Flair loses, he will retire from wrestling! Vader & Race don’t formally accept the challenge on this show, but let’s just say I’m looking forward to that match. Vader bragged about how he's already sent a lot of wrestlers into retirement (and in the case of Nikita Koloff and Joe Thurmond, it's actually true!) and of course he'd love to add the Nature Boy to this list.
The last tag match is Road Warrior Hawk & Rip Rogers v. Davey Boy Smith & Kole (AKA Booker T) from Harlem Heat.
Rip Rogers was one of my favorite jobbers from this era. He’s so excited to have his name drawn for this event that, as he and Hawk walk out to the ring, Rip’s giddy celebrating annoys Hawk, who clobbers him and knocks him down. As Kole comes out to the ring, he stomps on Rogers as well. Rogers is unable to participate in the match until the very end, as we’ll see. Stupid move of Hawk to smash his own teammate before the match.
By the way, during this match, Ventura makes a crack about how they’ll have a happy Thanksgiving because they haven’t been indicted. I wonder if that is a shot at Jerry Lawler, who had been indicted for statutory rape (I think it was) right around this time and thus had to miss Survivor Series.
During the match, Bulldog actually starts cheering on Hawk – the opposition – against his own teammate! This is stupid. WCW is trying to make us believe that winning Battlebowl and the ring that goes with it is really, really, important, yet they constantly have the wrestlers do things to undercut their chances of winning their match to qualify for Battlebowl. This sort of booking really makes no sense at all. I think WCW is insulting our intelligence a bit here. Even the announcers think it’s dumb, and it’s not easy to get Tony and Jesse to agree on something! Kole, understandably, doesn’t want to tag in Davey Boy, so most of this match is Hawk (who’s basically in a handicap match since he knocked out his own teammate) versus Kole. The ending, like the rest of the match, is unbelievably stupid. Hawk grabs Rogers, who has finally made it to the apron (but he’s not in the correct corner for a tag, plus there was no tag made anyway) and he picks up Rogers and throws him on top of Kole. Rogers sits on top of Kole and the referee counts to three for the win for Hawk and Rogers! WTF? Rogers was clearly not the legal man, so why is the referee counting? The ending made about as much sense as the rest of the match. It was surprising and disappointing that Bulldog & Kole lost. Poor Kole (Booker T) has done nothing but job since he joined WCW.
We’re finally up to the Battlebowl.
They’ve got a new rule for Battlebowl – while it’s a battle royal, if you throw your opponent over the top rope, but he lands on the walkway instead of the floor, he is not eliminated. Since the walkway is so wide, this basically means you’ve only got 3 sides instead of 4 to throw your opponent over. This rule would come into play. This dumb rule is inconsistent with their other dumb over the top rope rule where if you throw your opponent over the top rope, you are disqualified, even if he lands on the runway.
There should also be a countout rule. What’s to stop somebody from just leaving the ring and waiting until only one person is left before climbing back in??
Rip Rogers is the first one eliminated, in about 30 seconds. No surprise there but I would have loved it if he won.
At one point, Dustin Rhodes gets smashed into the ring post (outside the ring) and gets all bloodied.
I can’t believe that Hawk lasted so long – he made the final five.
Your final four are Sting, Vader, Steve Austin, and Ric Flair. Flair goes out on the wooden walkway and suplexes Harley Race. Vader comes out and attacks Flair, rendering him unable to compete, and he is taken out on a stretcher and we’re down to three.
Vader and Austin gang up on Sting, but Sting is eventually able to eliminate Austin (the ill advised charge at the person leaning on the ropes) and we’re down to just Sting and Vader! Unfortunately, Sting missies his Sting splash and goes over the top rope, eliminating himself and handing the win to Vader.
The Battlebowl lasted over 25 minutes, and the last maybe ten minutes was good (except for the ending with Sting stupidly eliminating himself) but the first half or so was very skippable.
Overall, not a particularly strong PPV. Many of the matches were too long (perhaps because, since Battlebowl is now its own PPV, they had to make the matches longer) and WCW did a terrible job of selling the importance of winning this thing. It had its moments, but not exactly a must see.
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Post by dbutler69 on Mar 21, 2024 15:24:07 GMT -5
I just finished watching Survivor Series 1993. Luckily we are back to the elimination style tag team matches. We’ve got four man tag teams in each match, plus the Smoky Mountain Wrestling Tag Team championship match will be held.
We start with Lex Luger and his family wishing us a happy Thanksgiving.
Bobby Heenan and Vince McMahon on commentary.
The biggest news is that, about a week before this, it was announced that Jerry Lawler would not be participating due to legal problems. This had to do with an indictment for sodomy and statutory rape, I think. I was surprised that McMahan actually said it was legal issues rather than making an angle out of it, like that the Harts attacked him and put him in the hospital or something. Anyway, this is bad news for the WWF as this was the hottest feud by far going into Survivor Series, though you’ve also got the proud American wrestlers versus the evil foreigners feuds, as well.
Anyway, the first match is Irwin R. Schyster, Diesel, Rick Martel & Adam Bomb (w/Harvey Wippleman) vs. Razor Ramon, Randy Savage, Marty Jannetty & 1-2-3 Kid.
Interesting that the heel team all come out together, to Diesel’s “music” but the Face team all come out one at a time, each to his own music. Also, as far as I know, this is the first time the 1-2-3 Kid has had his own music. After Ramon comes out, he take the mic and announces that Mr. Perfect has already “tagged out” and his replacement will be…Randy Savage! Savage comes out to a big pop. Perfect missed this because of a back injury. Perfect had been feuding with Diesel, so that angle bites the dust here. Savage is feuding with Crush (who recently turned heel and took Mr Fuji as his manager) and unfortunately Crush isn’t on the other team but wat can you do.
Marty Jannetty and the 1-2-3 Kid are the survivors from this match. This was a good match overall. While I fully expected the face team to win, I definitely didn’t expect Jannetty and Kid to be the two survivors! This also sets them up as an underdog tag team. I think both of these guys are very exciting, so it was good to see them survive. They also continued to play up some tension between Martel and Bomb/Whippleman which would seem to indicate that a face turn is coming for somebody.
Next match is Shawn Michaels and His Knights The Red Knight, The Blue Knight and The Black Knight vs. Bret, Owen, Bruce & Keith Hart (w/Stu Hart). This was of course supposed to be Jerry the King Lawler and high knights, which of course makes more sense because it’s then a king and his knights (the Lawler/Hart feud started because Hart won King of the Ring tournament and there’s only room for one king in the WWF!) but it was a bit late in the game so the WWF did what they could with the hand they were dealt. Too bad, since Hart/Lawler had been a hot feud with a lot of buildup. Anyway, I’ve read that the knights are Jeff Gaylord (Black), Greg Valentine (Blue) and Barry Horowitz (Red) although they wore masks and we were never told who they are. As far as the Harts, we all know Bret and Owen, Bruce was at the last PPV (where he acted like an ass, as usual) and WWF fans and pretty much the entire world has never seen Keith Hart before. So we’ve really got Bret and Owen with a couple of guys that nobody knows and who don’t have great reputations as wrestlers (or even as people, to judge even by Bret Hart’s own book). The prematch interview is weird, as they’re talking as if all the stuff that Jerry Lawler did (the insults to Bret’s family and when he really insulted Stu and Helen) were actually done by Shawn Michaels, in order to build some heat for this out of nowhere matchup. Before the match Michaels goes over and taunts the Hart family members sitting in the front row, again to try and build some heat for this thing.
Ray Combs (host of Family Feud) does the ring announcing, insulting the heels (as he did on a previous WWF PPV) but it would have been better if he could have been insulting Lawler instead of Michaels.
They mention that Bruce and Keith are a fireman and substitute teacher and haven’t wrestled in years, which doesn’t make Michaels and his knight look good when they start taking bumps for these Harts. There was a “boring” chant during this match. Not a good sign. Especially as, prior to the sudden departure of Lawler, this match was the most hyped one on the card. The crowd was dead for this match.
Anyway, this match was boring and much too long (almost 30 minutes!) and the crowd was dead for it (Jerry Lawler not being in it just killed this match), and the finish was lame, with Shawn Michaels just walking off. Also, I was annoyed that Owen got eliminated rather than Bruce and Keith. The events after this match famously set up the feud between Bret and Owen as Owen is upset over what happened (he bumped into Bret, who was standing on the apron, then Owen got rolled up while everybody ignored him and went to check on Bret) and he comes out and starts pushing Bret, then storms off to boos. So, the only good thing to come out of this match was the start of the Bret-Owen feud.
Next match is Rock n Roll Express (champs) vs. Heavenly Bodies for the Smoky Mountain Wrestling tag team championship. Good match, but the crowd didn’t seem to care. I guess because they’re not familiar with these teams. Some amusing spots early on and some very nice tag team work overall. The Heavenly Bodies win thanks to Jim Cornette’s tennis rack (and I found out that Smoky Mountain Wrestling has the same stupid top rope rule as WCW) and are your new Smoky Mountain Wrestling Tag Team Champs! I just wish the crowd had care more about this match.
Next match is Bam Bam Bigelow, Bastion Booger and The Headshrinkers – Samu and Fatu – (with Luna Vachon and Afa) vs. The Four Doinks (The Bushwhackers – Luke and Butch – and Men on a Mission – Mabel and Mo) (with Oscar)
This was billed as four Doinks, but the pictures showed four real Doinks (we’ve seen two – Matt Borne and Steve Keirn – at once before but never four) so the expectation was, well, not for this. We get what are clearly the Bushwhackers and Men on a Mission (even Oscar has the Doink makeup and wig) waltz up to ringside. We don’t see the “real” Doink (I think Matt Borne had been fired by this point – I’d read that Bam Bam ratted him out to McMahon for smoking pot in the locker room, adding some real life heat to their feud – so I believe this is Steve Keirn now) until after the match, when he appears on the large video screen to mock Bam Bam for losing the match. There had been a “we want Doink” chant during the match, so I suspect that the fans were as disappointed as I in not really getting even one Doink, let alone two or four.
This match was awful. Infamously bad. Oh, and the “Doink” team not only won, they shut out the other team! You’ve got perhaps the most dangerous tag team in WWF in the Headshrinkers, and a monster heel (and one of the best big men ever) who’s supposed to be an unstoppable force, and they get shut out by a comedy team! The freakin’ Bushwhackers! I’ll admit there were a couple of spots that amused me, but I think most wrestling fans over the age of 8 would cringe at this match. Mabel was clearly not legal man but allowed to make pin in one instance.
Bottom line, this was a comedy match, a joke of a match with the rules completely ignored.
For our main event, we’ve got All-Americans: Lex Luger, Undertaker & Steiner Brothers (w/Paul Bearer) vs. Foreign Fanatics: Yokozuna, Crush, Quebecer Jacques Rougeau & Ludwig Borga (w/James E. Cornette, Johnny Polo & Mr. Fuji)
I actually saw a Finnish flag in the crowd. I hope they strung that guy up!
A little background, Tatanka was originally on the All-Americans team, but in a match versus Ludvig Borga, he suffered his first loss, and both Borga and Yokozuna attacked him after the match, hospitalizing him and leaving him out of service for this event. He All-Americans eventually replaced him with the Undertaker, which of course the Foreign Fanatics were none too pleased about. Then, a few weeks later, Pierre was inured in a match against Lex Luger and left unavailable for this event. He was replaced by Crush, from that foreign nation of Hawaii. Crush has a cool new heel look, though to be honest, I liked his bright orange, yellow and purple babyface look too.
Elimination of Rick Steiner was really weak. He came off the top rope onto Borga, then Borga just rolled him over and pinned him. I have no idea what Rick couldn’t have kicked out of that. Nothing really happened to him. Plus it looked like he got his arm up in time, but Hebner counted it anyway. I wonder if Rick had a legit leg injury there, so they just counted him out.
Crush is eliminated by counting fighting Randy Savage outside the ring, to further that feud.
Since this is a comic book website, I have to mention that Bobby Heenan made a Batman reference. The way Savage keeps getting into the building after getting kicked out (in order to go after Crush) Heenan says “What is he, Batman? Is he coming in through the rafters?”
Undertaker was the last one in, and as hardly in this match at all. He and Yokozuna get the double countout, to set up their feud.
In the end, it’s down to just Luger and Borga (after all, they’ve been trying to build up a feud between these two as well) and Luger wins it for the All-Americans by hitting Borga on the head with his loaded elbow. I don’t understand why Luger isn’t required to wear a forearm pad anymore. They made a big deal out of it, then they just forget about it and he’s allowed to knock guys out with his metallic arm again.
Not a particularly good match, especially for the main event of a PPV. There was a cool Scott Steiner suplex of Borga off to rope, but not a lot else. Undertaker was hardly in this and he was the one everyone wanted to see the most.
Oh, and Santa appears and the end and goes into the ring with the victorious Lex Luger.
Overall, this was a weak PPV. The match with Ramon’s team vs. IRS’s team and the Heavenly Bodies vs. Rock N Roll Express were both very good matches, but everything else was skippable. In particular, the Hart match was a disaster with Lawler being out, and the Doink match was just ridiculous.
As an aside, at one point, they switched commentators for one match so that Gorilla Monsoon and Jim Ross called one match (I forget which one now) while Heenan and McMahon took their place and called the match for WWF Radio.
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 21, 2024 15:43:06 GMT -5
I watched Battlebowl 1993. The Battlebowl used to be part of Starrcade, but then WCW realized that there was a month on the calendar without a WCW PPV, so they gave this its own separate PPV. The rules are that 16 tag teams are randomly drawn from a hopper (by Gene Okerlund and Fifi) for 8 tag team matches. The 8 winning teams from those matches will all qualify for a 16 man battle royal, with the winner being the Battlebowl champ and getting a Superbowl-style piece of bling. These drawings are suppose to be random but it seems to almost always (last year it was every team) team up a face with a heel. The first tag match is Cactus Jack & Vader (w. Harley Race) v. Kane (from Harlem Heat, AKA Stevie Ray) & Charlie Norris. Jack & Vader still have a hot feud going, so they start beating on each other before the match starts until Race finally convinces them to work together. Vader wins it for his team with a sloppy powerbomb (he stumbled and dropped Norris, but it maybe have been Norris’s fault). It was pretty obvious who was going to win this match. The match itself was so-so. Nothing great, but not offensively bad either. Next is Paul Roma & Erik Watts v. Johnny B. Badd & Brian Knobbs (of the Nasty Boys, with Missy Hyatt). We actually have two faces teamed together in Roma and Watts. Knobbs wins it for his team (no surprise) by rolling through a bodypress and grabbing Watts’s tights. Again, this match, like the first one, wasn’t anything special. However, as the first match had some good storytelling between the Vader/Jack team, so this one did with the Knobbs/Badd team (Badd taking offense to Knobbs’s underhanded tactics during the match). Next match is The Shockmaster & Paul Orndorff v. Ricky Steamboat & Lord Steven Regal. We get another team made up of guys involved in a feud (Steamboat & Regal) – what are the odds? Anyway, this match did have some good storytelling and some amusing moments. The team of Orndorff & Shockmaster win (the first result of the night that actually surprised me – why put over the Shockmaster??) when Regal is about to clobber his opponent, but Steamboat (his own partner, mind you) grabs the umbrella from him, disgusted at this attempt at cheating, and hits his own partner with it (maybe accidentally but it looked intentional to me – either way it makes Steamboat look like a dummy) and Shockmaster flops on the fallen Regal for the pin. Steamboat came across as either very upright or very dumb, and I kinda think it was more of the latter than the former. Anyway, this was a fun match. As an aside, Shockmaster got a “Paula” chant started during the match, to aggravate his own teammate, which makes no sense. Next match is Awesome Kong & The Equalizer v. King Kong & Dustin Rhodes. Ugh. Dustin Rhodes and 3 big guys who are absolutely awful. Also, all three guys would as soon as clobber Rhodes as look at him, so he’s in a difficult position. The Kings are the first tag team to be on opposite sides. Unfortunately, nobody cares about these guys, so that angle goes nowhere, though there was one cute spot where King Kong was tagged in by Dustin to face Awesome Kong, then immediately tagged Dustin back in because he didn’t want to face his partner. Anyway, there’s chaos in the ring (as with most WCW tag team matches) when Dustin bulldogs Awesome Kong, and he and King Kong advance. No surprise there. Not a good match. I’ll just leave it at that. This was boring and the crowd didn’t care We’re only halfway through these things. Next match is Sting & Jerry Sags v. Ron Simmons & Keith Cole. Gee, I wonder who’s going to win this one. This was a decent match, though too much stalling. Anyway, Sting & Sags win when Sting gives Keith Cole the Stinger Splash, then, he’s about to go for his finisher, but Sags taps Sting on the shoulder (which I guess counts as a tag) then gives Keith Cole the elbow off the top rope (his finisher) then pins Cole. After the match, Ron Simmons, furious with Cole’s underperformance, attacks him. So it looks like we’ve got a heel turn for Simmons. Next match is Stunning Steve Austin & Ric Flair v. Maxx Payne & 2 Cold Scorpio. Again, not much suspense as to who is going to win. Flair/Austin win when Payne misses a corner charge (why do guys even attempt a corner charge???) and Flair slaps the figure four on him. Overall, this was a good match with good storytelling and psychology. It started with a fast, exciting exchange between Austin and Scorpio, then slowed down quite a bit, and the heat segment on Scorpio later on lasted a bit too long, but still a good match. Ric Flair, of all people, stopped his teammate Steve Austin from cheating. This theme of the face on the team being disgusted by the cheating of his heel teammate is getting used too often in this PPV. Next match is Ravishing Rick Rude & Shanghai Pierce v. Marcus Alexander Bagwell & Tex Slazenger. Pierce and Slazenger are a tag team, and early in the bout they refuse to fight each other (such loyalty from heels? How touching. Not like comic book supervillains who are all too glad to turn on each other.) but they do finally go at it hammer and tongs towards the end of the match. Tex Slazenger has such a large following (though I could never figure out why) that the crowd cheers for him and perhaps a face turn wouldn’t have been out of place. Rude tags in without Tex even knowing and delivers the Rude Awakening, so Rude and Pierce advance to Battlebowl. Overall, this match was too long and the heat segment on Bagwell lasted way too long, making this match another mediocre one, though Rude did have a couple of really cool moves. He did something like a vertical suplex but rather than falling backwards himself with Bagwell, he just dropped him. He had another move that looked like it would be a suplex but then he just dropped Bagwell on his face. Those moves looked devastating and aren’t things you see every day. After the match, Pierce and Slazenger make amends then beat on the prostrate Bagwell while Rude walks back to the locker room. I have to point out that, as Okerlund and Fifi are on camera after each match to draw names for the next match, Okerlund is acting like a total pervert. I guess that’s the running gag for the night. That sort of talk wouldn’t happen on WWF – yet. Also, at some point in this telecast, Ric Flair provided Vader and Race with a contract, challenging him to a title match at Starrcade, with the stipulation that if Flair loses, he will retire from wrestling! Vader & Race don’t formally accept the challenge on this show, but let’s just say I’m looking forward to that match. Vader bragged about how he's already sent a lot of wrestlers into retirement (and in the case of Nikita Koloff and Joe Thurmond, it's actually true!) and of course he'd love to add the Nature Boy to this list. The last tag match is Road Warrior Hawk & Rip Rogers v. Davey Boy Smith & Kole (AKA Booker T) from Harlem Heat. Rip Rogers was one of my favorite jobbers from this era. He’s so excited to have his name drawn for this event that, as he and Hawk walk out to the ring, Rip’s giddy celebrating annoys Hawk, who clobbers him and knocks him down. As Kole comes out to the ring, he stomps on Rogers as well. Rogers is unable to participate in the match until the very end, as we’ll see. Stupid move of Hawk to smash his own teammate before the match. By the way, during this match, Ventura makes a crack about how they’ll have a happy Thanksgiving because they haven’t been indicted. I wonder if that is a shot at Jerry Lawler, who had been indicted for statutory rape (I think it was) right around this time and thus had to miss Survivor Series. During the match, Bulldog actually starts cheering on Hawk – the opposition – against his own teammate! This is stupid. WCW is trying to make us believe that winning Battlebowl and the ring that goes with it is really, really, important, yet they constantly have the wrestlers do things to undercut their chances of winning their match to qualify for Battlebowl. This sort of booking really makes no sense at all. I think WCW is insulting our intelligence a bit here. Even the announcers think it’s dumb, and it’s not easy to get Tony and Jesse to agree on something! Kole, understandably, doesn’t want to tag in Davey Boy, so most of this match is Hawk (who’s basically in a handicap match since he knocked out his own teammate) versus Kole. The ending, like the rest of the match, is unbelievably stupid. Hawk grabs Rogers, who has finally made it to the apron (but he’s not in the correct corner for a tag, plus there was no tag made anyway) and he picks up Rogers and throws him on top of Kole. Rogers sits on top of Kole and the referee counts to three for the win for Hawk and Rogers! WTF? Rogers was clearly not the legal man, so why is the referee counting? The ending made about as much sense as the rest of the match. It was surprising and disappointing that Bulldog & Kole lost. Poor Kole (Booker T) has done nothing but job since he joined WCW. We’re finally up to the Battlebowl. They’ve got a new rule for Battlebowl – while it’s a battle royal, if you throw your opponent over the top rope, but he lands on the walkway instead of the floor, he is not eliminated. Since the walkway is so wide, this basically means you’ve only got 3 sides instead of 4 to throw your opponent over. This rule would come into play. This dumb rule is inconsistent with their other dumb over the top rope rule where if you throw your opponent over the top rope, you are disqualified, even if he lands on the runway. There should also be a countout rule. What’s to stop somebody from just leaving the ring and waiting until only one person is left before climbing back in?? Rip Rogers is the first one eliminated, in about 30 seconds. No surprise there but I would have loved it if he won. At one point, Dustin Rhodes gets smashed into the ring post (outside the ring) and gets all bloodied. I can’t believe that Hawk lasted so long – he made the final five. Your final four are Sting, Vader, Steve Austin, and Ric Flair. Flair goes out on the wooden walkway and suplexes Harley Race. Vader comes out and attacks Flair, rendering him unable to compete, and he is taken out on a stretcher and we’re down to three. Vader and Austin gang up on Sting, but Sting is eventually able to eliminate Austin (the ill advised charge at the person leaning on the ropes) and we’re down to just Sting and Vader! Unfortunately, Sting missies his Sting splash and goes over the top rope, eliminating himself and handing the win to Vader. The Battlebowl lasted over 25 minutes, and the last maybe ten minutes was good (except for the ending with Sting stupidly eliminating himself) but the first half or so was very skippable. Overall, not a particularly strong PPV. Many of the matches were too long (perhaps because, since Battlebowl is now its own PPV, they had to make the matches longer) and WCW did a terrible job of selling the importance of winning this thing. It had its moments, but not exactly a must see. I’d agree it had its moments - and I could always get on board with the novelty of face/heel combos, but in typical WCW fashion, it was disjointed, often lacking logic, etc. At the time, I wanted the WWF to do something similar - and I believe they’d have booked it better. Imagine in, say, early 1995, Bret Hart & Shawn Michaels vs. Razor Ramon & Owen Hart. Or in 1992, something like Hawk & Ted DiBiase vs. Hulk Hogan & The Model Rick Martel. Strange bedfellows and unique combinations should always work, but only WCW could mess it up. I agree with you about the Battlebowl rules. I believe if you’re gonna book this thing, then, firstly, faces and heels need to work together. In 1991, Abdullah the Butcher attacking his partner Sting (they were facing Bobby Eaton & Flyin’ Brian) makes sense as Abdullah was booked as a wildman. But Davey Boy cheering on Hawk, or Steamboat hitting Regal with the umbrella, well those things don’t work. I like it when things make sense. One of my favourite Royal Rumble moments is in 1990, when DiBiase, Jim Neidhart, Haku, Smash, and Jimmy Snuka all teamed up to eliminate Earthquake. That’s teamwork! In a Lethal Lottery/Battlebowl concept, it makes sense for strange bedfellows to work together for the chance to win that trophy. As ever, my friend, you picked apart the lack of logic well. If memory serves me right, the concept wasn’t used again until Slamboree 1996 - and I don’t believe it was done well, but you may have a different view. So, dbutler69 , if the WWF had done this gimmick during the Federation Era, can you think of, say, 3 matches you’d have liked. Mine would be the following: * Hulk Hogan & Earthquake vs. Ultimate Warrior & Rick Rude * Bret Hart & Ric Flair vs. Macho Man & Kamala * Hacksaw Jim Duggan & Ted DiBiase vs. IRS & Big Boss Man So many choices!
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Post by dbutler69 on Mar 21, 2024 15:51:22 GMT -5
driver1980, I too like the Battlebowl format a lot and with the WWF had done it. It's pretty tough to choose what matches I'd want, as there are so many possibilities. It also depends upon what year, since so many guys switch between face and heel, a given tag team's dynamics will change a lot depending on which year it is, even given the same two guys.
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 21, 2024 15:56:54 GMT -5
I just finished watching Survivor Series 1993. Luckily we are back to the elimination style tag team matches. We’ve got four man tag teams in each match, plus the Smoky Mountain Wrestling Tag Team championship match will be held. We start with Lex Luger and his family wishing us a happy Thanksgiving. Bobby Heenan and Vince McMahon on commentary. The biggest news is that, about a week before this, it was announced that Jerry Lawler would not be participating due to legal problems. This had to do with an indictment for sodomy and statutory rape, I think. I was surprised that McMahan actually said it was legal issues rather than making an angle out of it, like that the Harts attacked him and put him in the hospital or something. Anyway, this is bad news for the WWF as this was the hottest feud by far going into Survivor Series, though you’ve also got the proud American wrestlers versus the evil foreigners feuds, as well. Anyway, the first match is Irwin R. Schyster, Diesel, Rick Martel & Adam Bomb (w/Harvey Wippleman) vs. Razor Ramon, Randy Savage, Marty Jannetty & 1-2-3 Kid. Interesting that the heel team all come out together, to Diesel’s “music” but the Face team all come out one at a time, each to his own music. Also, as far as I know, this is the first time the 1-2-3 Kid has had his own music. After Ramon comes out, he take the mic and announces that Mr. Perfect has already “tagged out” and his replacement will be…Randy Savage! Savage comes out to a big pop. Perfect missed this because of a back injury. Perfect had been feuding with Diesel, so that angle bites the dust here. Savage is feuding with Crush (who recently turned heel and took Mr Fuji as his manager) and unfortunately Crush isn’t on the other team but wat can you do. Marty Jannetty and the 1-2-3 Kid are the survivors from this match. This was a good match overall. While I fully expected the face team to win, I definitely didn’t expect Jannetty and Kid to be the two survivors! This also sets them up as an underdog tag team. I think both of these guys are very exciting, so it was good to see them survive. They also continued to play up some tension between Martel and Bomb/Whippleman which would seem to indicate that a face turn is coming for somebody. Next match is Shawn Michaels and His Knights The Red Knight, The Blue Knight and The Black Knight vs. Bret, Owen, Bruce & Keith Hart (w/Stu Hart). This was of course supposed to be Jerry the King Lawler and high knights, which of course makes more sense because it’s then a king and his knights (the Lawler/Hart feud started because Hart won King of the Ring tournament and there’s only room for one king in the WWF!) but it was a bit late in the game so the WWF did what they could with the hand they were dealt. Too bad, since Hart/Lawler had been a hot feud with a lot of buildup. Anyway, I’ve read that the knights are Jeff Gaylord (Black), Greg Valentine (Blue) and Barry Horowitz (Red) although they wore masks and we were never told who they are. As far as the Harts, we all know Bret and Owen, Bruce was at the last PPV (where he acted like an ass, as usual) and WWF fans and pretty much the entire world has never seen Keith Hart before. So we’ve really got Bret and Owen with a couple of guys that nobody knows and who don’t have great reputations as wrestlers (or even as people, to judge even by Bret Hart’s own book). The prematch interview is weird, as they’re talking as if all the stuff that Jerry Lawler did (the insults to Bret’s family and when he really insulted Stu and Helen) were actually done by Shawn Michaels, in order to build some heat for this out of nowhere matchup. Before the match Michaels goes over and taunts the Hart family members sitting in the front row, again to try and build some heat for this thing. Ray Combs (host of Family Feud) does the ring announcing, insulting the heels (as he did on a previous WWF PPV) but it would have been better if he could have been insulting Lawler instead of Michaels. They mention that Bruce and Keith are a fireman and substitute teacher and haven’t wrestled in years, which doesn’t make Michaels and his knight look good when they start taking bumps for these Harts. There was a “boring” chant during this match. Not a good sign. Especially as, prior to the sudden departure of Lawler, this match was the most hyped one on the card. The crowd was dead for this match. Anyway, this match was boring and much too long (almost 30 minutes!) and the crowd was dead for it (Jerry Lawler not being in it just killed this match), and the finish was lame, with Shawn Michaels just walking off. Also, I was annoyed that Owen got eliminated rather than Bruce and Keith. The events after this match famously set up the feud between Bret and Owen as Owen is upset over what happened (he bumped into Bret, who was standing on the apron, then Owen got rolled up while everybody ignored him and went to check on Bret) and he comes out and starts pushing Bret, then storms off to boos. So, the only good thing to come out of this match was the start of the Bret-Owen feud. Next match is Rock n Roll Express (champs) vs. Heavenly Bodies for the Smoky Mountain Wrestling tag team championship. Good match, but the crowd didn’t seem to care. I guess because they’re not familiar with these teams. Some amusing spots early on and some very nice tag team work overall. The Heavenly Bodies win thanks to Jim Cornette’s tennis rack (and I found out that Smoky Mountain Wrestling has the same stupid top rope rule as WCW) and are your new Smoky Mountain Wrestling Tag Team Champs! I just wish the crowd had care more about this match. Next match is Bam Bam Bigelow, Bastion Booger and The Headshrinkers – Samu and Fatu – (with Luna Vachon and Afa) vs. The Four Doinks (The Bushwhackers – Luke and Butch – and Men on a Mission – Mabel and Mo) (with Oscar)This was billed as four Doinks, but the pictures showed four real Doinks (we’ve seen two – Matt Borne and Steve Keirn – at once before but never four) so the expectation was, well, not for this. We get what are clearly the Bushwhackers and Men on a Mission (even Oscar has the Doink makeup and wig) waltz up to ringside. We don’t see the “real” Doink (I think Matt Borne had been fired by this point – I’d read that Bam Bam ratted him out to McMahon for smoking pot in the locker room, adding some real life heat to their feud – so I believe this is Steve Keirn now) until after the match, when he appears on the large video screen to mock Bam Bam for losing the match. There had been a “we want Doink” chant during the match, so I suspect that the fans were as disappointed as I in not really getting even one Doink, let alone two or four. This match was awful. Infamously bad. Oh, and the “Doink” team not only won, they shut out the other team! You’ve got perhaps the most dangerous tag team in WWF in the Headshrinkers, and a monster heel (and one of the best big men ever) who’s supposed to be an unstoppable force, and they get shut out by a comedy team! The freakin’ Bushwhackers! I’ll admit there were a couple of spots that amused me, but I think most wrestling fans over the age of 8 would cringe at this match. Mabel was clearly not legal man but allowed to make pin in one instance. Bottom line, this was a comedy match, a joke of a match with the rules completely ignored. For our main event, we’ve got All-Americans: Lex Luger, Undertaker & Steiner Brothers (w/Paul Bearer) vs. Foreign Fanatics: Yokozuna, Crush, Quebecer Jacques Rougeau & Ludwig Borga (w/James E. Cornette, Johnny Polo & Mr. Fuji)I actually saw a Finnish flag in the crowd. I hope they strung that guy up! A little background, Tatanka was originally on the All-Americans team, but in a match versus Ludvig Borga, he suffered his first loss, and both Borga and Yokozuna attacked him after the match, hospitalizing him and leaving him out of service for this event. He All-Americans eventually replaced him with the Undertaker, which of course the Foreign Fanatics were none too pleased about. Then, a few weeks later, Pierre was inured in a match against Lex Luger and left unavailable for this event. He was replaced by Crush, from that foreign nation of Hawaii. Crush has a cool new heel look, though to be honest, I liked his bright orange, yellow and purple babyface look too. Elimination of Rick Steiner was really weak. He came off the top rope onto Borga, then Borga just rolled him over and pinned him. I have no idea what Rick couldn’t have kicked out of that. Nothing really happened to him. Plus it looked like he got his arm up in time, but Hebner counted it anyway. I wonder if Rick had a legit leg injury there, so they just counted him out. Crush is eliminated by counting fighting Randy Savage outside the ring, to further that feud. Since this is a comic book website, I have to mention that Bobby Heenan made a Batman reference. The way Savage keeps getting into the building after getting kicked out (in order to go after Crush) Heenan says “What is he, Batman? Is he coming in through the rafters?” Undertaker was the last one in, and as hardly in this match at all. He and Yokozuna get the double countout, to set up their feud. In the end, it’s down to just Luger and Borga (after all, they’ve been trying to build up a feud between these two as well) and Luger wins it for the All-Americans by hitting Borga on the head with his loaded elbow. I don’t understand why Luger isn’t required to wear a forearm pad anymore. They made a big deal out of it, then they just forget about it and he’s allowed to knock guys out with his metallic arm again. Not a particularly good match, especially for the main event of a PPV. There was a cool Scott Steiner suplex of Borga off to rope, but not a lot else. Undertaker was hardly in this and he was the one everyone wanted to see the most. Oh, and Santa appears and the end and goes into the ring with the victorious Lex Luger. Overall, this was a weak PPV. The match with Ramon’s team vs. IRS’s team and the Heavenly Bodies vs. Rock N Roll Express were both very good matches, but everything else was skippable. In particular, the Hart match was a disaster with Lawler being out, and the Doink match was just ridiculous. As an aside, at one point, they switched commentators for one match so that Gorilla Monsoon and Jim Ross called one match (I forget which one now) while Heenan and McMahon took their place and called the match for WWF Radio. I was at least glad they returned to the elimination format in 1993. However, I believe the buyrate was the lowest Survivor Series buyrate at that point, which is probably why future events moved forward with a combination of elimination matches and singles matches. Personally, I wish they could always be elimination matches exclusively; in today’s WWE, too many PPVs lack a distinct flavour. Imagine if, say, last year, we could have had Roman Reigns, Brock Lesnar & The Usos vs Cody Rhodes, Bobby Lashley, Seth Rollins & Drew McIntyre. No titles on the line, but lots of flavour. I did enjoy Team Razor versus Team IRS. Macho Man eliminating Diesel seemed a big surprise at the time, was this Diesel’s first televised loss? It may have been, but don’t quote me on that. I was sad Mr. Perfect wasn’t there, though. Shawn Michaels is a stellar talent, but the complete absence of any storyline reason for him to be there made his presence counter-productive, if you ask me. Makes you wonder if there were other plans for him prior to this. The whole thing had been built around Hart/Lawler. Sometimes a substitution doesn’t work. At least, as you show, we got the beginning of the Owen heel turn. It’s a shame the crowd weren’t into the SMW match. I did quite enjoy The Four Doinks vs Team Bigelow - as a spectacle. It’s a very “Doink thing” for Doink to have down, not showing up for his own match. Quite honestly, the commentary is probably the best thing about this match: Bobby Heenan: What’s that smell?! Vince: Booger! (It was a bit of a repulsive gimmick, wasn’t it?) As for the All-Americans vs. Foreign Fanatics bout, it was okay, I guess, but maybe it left me feeling unfulfilled. I guess Luger/Borda was based on the war that the US had with Finland in 1993 (which the news channels must have chosen not to cover). Honestly, I never got the whole Finland thing. The WWF being stuck in the past with German and Japanese heels made sense, but I don’t recall animosity between the US and Finland. Also, I wonder if there were any plans for Undertaker before he replaced Tatanka.
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Post by codystarbuck on Mar 21, 2024 15:57:19 GMT -5
Re: "Demotions"
The problem with the WWF formula was that once someone had been fed to Hogan and squashed, there really wasn't anywhere for them to go, except down the card. It was a bit different when your champ wasn't some huge superhero, even with Bruno. The champ could defeat the guy and he could move into the IC (or equivalent, since it only stretches back to the mid-late 70s) mix or another program. In reality, they usually cycled out of the territory for a bit. Usual formula was a guy came in, got some wins, moved up in contention, beat the stepping stone, got the title feud, which went around the loop, then the guy left soon after to work somewhere else for a bit or in a tag team, for a bit, until he faced the champ again, if he got a return program.
With Hogan, they built up the monster, they had some encounters and then the big match, with Hogan going over in under 20 minutes. Then, the monster is slain and they pretty much never get back to the top.
Orndorff was an exception, because he was a great worker and had a good size that made him visually look competitive with Hogan, but not so huge that you have to protect the monster gimmick. So, Orndorff could feud with other people, then turn his sights back on Hogan. Same with Savage.
Bundy was pretty limited and as soon as you beat him, there was nowhere to go. Same with Studd. Having seen Bob Backlund pin Studd, I never cared about any match with him in the Hulkamania era (and other than Andre, there wasn't much). Studd was pretty limited, anyway.
Demolition was a tag team, which was almost never a priority in the WWF, in any era. They had also been around a while and were not protected like the Road Warriors were, in Crockett.
Luger just never clicked, with Vince. He had the size that Vince loved, but he also came in with a sports agent, which Vince didn't and Vince really didn't know how to play to Luger's strengths. Dusty did and so did Flair. He never really clicked with the WWF audience, even with the whole Lex Express thing. That probably hurt more than helped, as Luger just wasn't the smiling babyface to meet the public. Luger, for real, always came across badly to people because he came off as arrogant, without intending it. It took the whole Elizabeth thing and his health issues to humble him a bit. From what I have heard, he's a pretty nice guy, now.
With Austin, you have to remember, he had physical issues, going back to the pile driver with Owen Hart. He got into the ring less and less, both to make it mean something and to protect his neck. This was the botching of the NWO coming to the WWE, with Vince not using them the way they were in WCW, because he wasn't going to make his stars look weak, especially to an aging Hogan, an injury-prone Nash (one step and down) and a questionable Hall. Hogan got the program with Rock because, with Austin's issues, Rock was definably the top draw. I'm sure Hogan maneuvered for it, too, since Rock was red hot and had his own movie out there. Austin knew Scott Hall from the WCW days, when he was The Diamond Stud, with DDP. So, for Austin, it was more of a working with an old friend, though Hall was a mess and was fired a couple of months later, after the Plane Ride From Hell.
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Post by commond on Mar 21, 2024 16:17:28 GMT -5
Austin was supposed to wrestle Hogan at WrestleMania X8, but they refused to job to each other and there was still heat between them over Austin's WCW days. Austin was on his way out at the time. He no-showed the following night's RAW and took the week off without permission. Then he started complaining about the programs he was being given, and when he no-showed again in June, they buried him. It was kind of annoying, actually, as he was going to feud with Eddie, then Brock, both of which could have been good.
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Post by driver1980 on Mar 21, 2024 16:20:03 GMT -5
Austin was supposed to wrestle Hogan at WrestleMania X8, but they refused to job to each other and there was still heat between them over Austin's WCW days. Austin was on his way out at the time. He no-showed the following night's RAW and took the week off without permission. Then he started complaining about the programs he was being given, and when he no-showed again in June, they buried him. It was kind of annoying, actually, as he was going to feud with Eddie, then Brock, both of which could have been good. I remember that WWE Confidential piece on Austin, plus all the anti-Austin stuff in Raw Magazine. At times, WWE was in a league of its own when it came to using its programmes and publications to bury former employees (or employees on suspension). Not that other promotions didn’t do that, of course. For me, and it was never gonna happen, the perfect time for Austin/Hogan would have been 1994/95, although I’m certain Mr “I Claimed To Have Wrestled At Wembley Stadium” would not have jobbed to Austin, not even if a rematch was promised.
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