There is no way Piper would job to the Anabolic Warrior.  Piper in 10 minutes, with the Sleeper (possibly as a shoot, because few could stand Hellwig).

Piper was actually considered to be one not to mess with, by the boys, to a certain extent.  he had trained as both a boxer and wrestler, as a teen, and trained a bit with Gene LeBell, while in LA (especially with the way he was riling the Mexican fans, in his feud with the Guerreros).  When Ric Flair defended the NWA title in the Dominican Republic, for Jack Veneno (where he dropped the title to avoid getting shot by the crowd), he took Piper along as a bodyguard, to watch for any shenanigans from Veneno (promoter and wrestler) or the crowd.  In his book, Flair said Piper was paid with a spittoon full of cocaine.  Not sure I buy that part; but, I wouldn't be surprised if a certain amount of coke factored into the payoff.

ps "I do not hit a man when he is down....I kick him! It's easier!"

RIP Hot Rod.....

Al Snow has gone on record that Hogan vs Andre is the best match, since it drew the crowd.  My answer is, "Whatever, Al."  Yes, Hogan and Andre drew the lion's share of the crowd; but not the entire audience.  However, in terms of performance on the night, you can't touch Savage and Steamboat.  They put on an emotional and athletic match that had fans on their feet the entire time.

Hogan and Andre had a great (if totally fictional) story to their match, as Andre had turned heel (he had worked Heel in Japan) and turned on "friend" Hulk Hogan.  Andre had "never lost a match," could Hogan defeat him?  Andre had never contended for a world title; could he win it?  His health wasn't good, would he make the match?  That made for great drama to sell the match.

The reality is, that Hogan and Andre had wrestled before, several times, including 1980's Shea Stadium card, where Andre defeated Hogan, in the semi-main event (under Bruno Sammartino vs Larry Zbysko, in the blowoff of their feud).  Hogan played a heel then and that past was erased from WWF history (pretty much anything in the old WWWF was ignored, unless it served a storyline purpose, like title lineages and only certain people, even then).  Also, Andre had lost matches before, to Ronnie Garvin, in Knoxville, in the mid-late 70s, in Mexico, to El Canek (UWA's top hwt star), and in Japan to Antonio Inoki (New Japan promoter and star).  The myth of the bodyslam was even more outrageous, as he was slammed by multiple wrestlers, including the aforementioned people, and Harley Race, multiple times.   If he liked and respected the wrestler, he'd let them slam him.  However, the bulk of the audience was oblivious to that history and modern fans only know the WWE official history, which would make Stalin proud (as far as revisionism).

So; the casual fans were mostly there for Andre and Hogan and bought all of the myths.  And, it was geared to those mythic elements.  Andre couldn't do much because his back was in horrible shape (he had started wrestling with the singlet because he was forced to wear a back brace); so, he was limited in what he could do.  They went for an almost immediate pin by Andre, when Hogan collapsed under him, for a fast two count.   Andre is then on offense, in standard Hogan formula, as he sells for the heel, for a bit.  However, all Andre was capable of were a few clubbing forearms, then a bodyslam or two, where Hogan did the work (in a bodyslam, the slammee jumps upward and the slammer guides them into the forward bump).  Hogan sells on the matt while Andre stands there.  Andre throws him in the corner and slowly goes over, while Hogan sells, then they work corner spots where Andre doesn't really have to do much and can hang on, while Hogan sells.  Then, Hogan slips out and the do the hope spot, with Hogan on offense.   Andre never bumps, just reels as Hogan hits him (rather lightly, if you pay attention).  Then, Hogan rushes the corner and takes the boot, while  Andre rests and Hogan sells.

They do a bearhug spot, which is a rest hold to let wrestlers get their wind back and get the crowd anticipating a break or end (if both wrestlers have their feet on the matt, it isn't a finish; if one is off his feet, it could be).  Andre can lean on Hogan while he sells non-existent pressure.  They do the false passing out spot, then Hogan makes the miraculous comeback and breaks the hold, then hits Andre off the ropes.  Andre catches him with a very badly timed boot and Hogan has to sell it, even though it barely makes contact, rolling himself backwards out of the ring, to the floor.  Andre follows outside and hits Hogan, then they rest against the ringpost.  Andre does a nice chest slap, which makes a ton of noise (won't say it doesn't hurt; but, Andre didn't lay it in, like Flair and Ronnie Garvin, or Wahoo and Johnny Valentine would).  Go for pile drive spot, which isn't going to happen, because Andre can't go up.  Instead, he struggles to get under Hogan and lift him enough for him to roll over Andre's back, rather than do a proper backdrop.

Andre rolls Hogan in and they go for a rope spot, where Andre misses the boot and Hogan lands a clothesline and Andre leaves his feet, for the first time, with heenan going nuts.  Now it is time for Hogan's offense.  Hogan does the Superman comeback (Hulks out, whatever).  Andre gets to his feet to be in position for the slam, and the place erupts.  Hogan does the  legdrop, 1....2...3 and it's over.

Total elapsed actual time of the match is about 12 minutes, which is long for Hogan and an eternity for Andre, in this shape.

Now, what sells the thing is the crowd atmosphere, as they react as programmed to the spots.  Gorilla Monsoon and Jesse Ventura add the story and emotion with their commentary and Heenan's reaction sell the idea that Andre is in trouble.  The match plays to the emotional reactions that had been set up in the buildup to Wrestlemania, the consistent hype through the PPV, and the calling of the match.  If you turn off the sound, you can still see the story and the drama; but, it isn't the same as watching Savage and Steamboat work an athletic match.  This is working in the sense of drawing the crowd into the story, making every element mean something, and taking things to a logical, yet still exciting finish.  Steamboat and Savage were doing a showcase of physical working:  the ebb and flow of heel and babyface as the heel takes shortcuts and hurts the babyface, who counters with grit & determination and skill, putting the heel in jeopardy, until the babyface emerges triumphant and honor wins the day and the title.

By contrast, the Shea Stadium match between Hogan and Andre was far more of the physical working variety.  Andre was in better shape and could move around the ring and do things.  I saw him in 1982, coming off the top (well, 2nd) rope on Blackjack Mulligan.  In Japan, he would bump for the guys he respected.  In the 70s, he would take to the air and matt wrestled.  Hogan was a lazy worker in the WWF.  he didn't do much bumping; mostly selling, while opponents bumped for him.  By contrast, in the AWA and in New Japan, he bumped like crazy and worked more athletic spots, in longer matches..  in the WWF, he played the psychological worker, giving the crowd just enough.  It worked, so you can't exactly fault him, as he was the biggest draw in the business, for several years.  However, it didn't work well enough to successfully promote in the South.  Crockett and the other NWA promotions had faster, more physical working styles and Southern style fans hated the slower, moe cartoony WWF style and their few attempts to run in Southern cities failed to draw the same big crowds they had elsewhere.

At the time, I was in college, had been a rabid fan since 1982, watching ICW, Georgia, Crockett, Mid-South and the AWA and I hated the boring WWF style, which tended to kick-punch offense, power moves, and little matt wrestling.  The exceptions were the Calgary guys (Hart Foundation and Bulldogs) and the other ex-NWA guys, who got to work with other NWA guys (like the Killer Bees).  Hogan's matches were like watching paint dry and were predictable, to me.  Savage livened things up tremendously, as did Steamboat.  I watched WWF for those guys (more on the Superstars syndicated show than the USA shows), SNME, and Piper's Pit.  It wasn't a contest.  So, for fans like me, Savage and Steamboat was more like what we saw regularly from Crockett (and the better AWA matches).  Hogan and Andre is a typical WWF match, though one with greater drama than average.  Savage and Steamboat was a textbook NWA match, except they didn't call it in the ring, since Savage wasn't comfortable working that way.  Steamboat and Flair never planned anything.  They just started calling spots, based on the crowd, until it was time for the finish..

In the past 2 pages of this thread ... I really don't know Piper that well and I know that he's a popular wrestler and all that and you two really adds a lot to this discussion.

So, Fighting Spirit Magazine published its final issue today. This leaves only Pro Wrestling Illustrated on the shelves (WrestleTalk is a print magazine, but can only be ordered online).

I'm gonna be brutal now...

Too many wrestling magazines of recent years have done pointless recaps of TV, PPVs, etc. When I ordered a WrestleTalk issue, there were LOTS of pages of recaps of TNA, WWF, ROH, PPVs, etc.

We've seen the events! If not, we know the results. Isn't this akin to a TV magazine recapping scene after scene from various TV shows? I much prefer analysis and opinion - and historical stuff.

I stopped buying some of the wrestling magazines here as I got *bored* with page after page of recap of WWF, TNA, etc. The recaps were for month-old (or two-month old) events due to publishing deadlines. And yet these magazines often scrapped or sent on hiatus great features. The aforementioned WrestleTalk had great features such as "Q&A" pages and DVD reviews, but on occasion, it had no space for such features. No, because you bloody chose to recap every nanosecond of Impact or Smackdown.

Regurgitating what we've ALREADY SEEN is pointless. And boring, too.

"So-and-so bodyslammed so-and-so. So-and-so interfered. The bell rang...Then so-and-so cut a promo. After that, the next match began..."

Yawn, yawn, yawn.

If wrestling magazines are going to have a future, it has to feature analysis, historical stuff, etc. Instead of pages of recaps of TV shows/PPVs, which make no sense in the digital age, do retrospectives on wrestlers, examine the history of something like EMLL, etc.

Oh well...

Some on Twitter expressed the same view.

I read a sci-fi magazine called Starburst. It reviews shows. It analyses them. It doesn't give a scene-for-scene recap.

Same with, say, a football magazine. No long, tiresome descriptions of play, just analysis, history, examination, etc.

Pages 22-31 of Fighting Spiriting (final issue) recap the TV and PPVs. If I've seen John Cena's rap battle with the Usos, I don't need to read a description of it.

I'm glad PWI is still going. It's expensive, but at least it doesn't do the long boring recaps. It has arena reports (which I skip). I understand those for completist purposes. The rest of the magazine is analysis, opinion, reports from international events, independent events, humour, a letters page, etc.

Even as a wrestling fan, there is nothing more boring than reading a blow-by-blow account of a match. None of us do it in this topic. You provide great analysis/views on wrestling. Cody does - and provides historical context. That's the way to do it.