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Post by crazyoldhermit on Apr 16, 2016 2:57:52 GMT -5
A crucial difference between Marvel Studios and the handling of DC at WB is that Marvel isn't afraid to plant a flag and dare audiences to accept what comic fans have accepted for years, whereas WB seems embarassed by their properties and does everything possible to overcompensate for that out of fear of being rejected. What happens? WB movies get lukewarm reception, while everyone and their mother salutes Marvel's flag. Not everyone. I'm not saying that they should try for the WB realistic approach, but Batman and Superman benefit from it. It works for Batman, but thats just because that approach is a natural fit for Batman anyway. It's no different than making a Cold War-era spy thriller for Captain America or a heist movie for Ant-Man, it's genre and tone that is handpicked and appropriate for the character. Which makes sense, because the tone of the DC filmverse originates from Christopher Nolan pitching that style of movie. But for Superman? No way in hell.
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Post by Ozymandias on Apr 16, 2016 3:54:43 GMT -5
But for Superman? No way in hell. I liked the fact that MoS, was a science fiction movie, not about super-heroes and super-villains, but about aliens. That angle is usually underplayed, and I congratulate Snyder for deciding to go for it. BvS doesn't work that well for me, because it deviated from that path. At least, it apparently did, with the JL cameos. That whole "they were always there" argument, better be explained in future films.
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Post by sabongero on Jul 29, 2020 12:09:03 GMT -5
I was just re-reading the first Marvel Civil War again recently. Back in 2007 when I read the series, I was on the side of Captain America and definitely backed all the reasons of deontology as opposed to utilitarianism. Let's look at the setting at the time. President G W Bush was at the helm. The United States was involved with two wars at the same time (Iraq and Afghanistan). The economy was under a recession. Gasoline prices was skyrocketing at the time and eventually increased to a little over $ 5.00 US Dollars per gallon, jobs leaving the country, unfair trade with other countries benefiting them more than the U.S.A, and other things. Then the bubble burst with the housing and mortgage crisis. And after a few years there was the banking collapse under the new regime (new president, congress, and senate... it was a republican majority on all three anymore). And the then unbelievable quote by President Obama, "We cannot allow big banks to fail." 700 billion U.S. Dollars was created by the U.S. government in order to purchase the toxic assets of banks. After which the news coverage was of bank officials in extravagant vacations spending millions of dollars. That didn't sit well with the people.
So why Captain America... the U.S. government wasn't popular because of the dual war
Fast forward to the middle of 2020.
Re-reading it during a pandemic and race rallies, with the unemployment rate up to 14.7 % in the U.S.A., lockdowns in various cities, the gasoline prices are at a current all time low $ 2.18 U.S. Dollars per gallon for regular unleaded, the unemployment rate down to 11.1% in the U.S.A. and opening up little by little of various activities, just one war, and trade wars with China and other countries to keep many jobs in the U.S.A. instead of leaving the country (i.e. Ford and G.E.) and this and that... plus I will add the extreme popularity if the three Iron Man movies and the juggernaut that was the Avengers movies, re-reading the first Marvel Civil War series, I am not as almost totally against Tony Stark and the Registration forces, as I am leaning towards respecting the utilitarian point of view. Given the pandemic, I would back the country/government's utilitarian decision over the individual deontological decision regarding the individual's choice during the pandemic. After all, let's say I am on line at the local drugstore inside and while waiting in line, another customer showed up with no mask on, while the rest of us are wearing masks, and he says that he doesn't wear the mask because he is not sick and doesn't believe in wearing the mask. What do you think is going to happen? I'll hit him over the head with my cane (which I would). So the decision for the greater good of the many over the few, I'll somewhat understand and respect Iron Man's p.o.v. unlike back when I first read it, I almost denounced Iron Man as a fascist and definitely considered him as a super-villain. ESPECIALLY when Ed Brubaker's Captain America issue #25 came out.
Has anyone re-read the first Marvel Civil War series recently during the corona virus pandemic this year? And if so, has any of you changed sides or at least had less hatred for Iron Man/Tony Stark's views on that series.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jul 29, 2020 14:56:59 GMT -5
Has anyone re-read the first Marvel Civil War series recently during the corona virus pandemic this year? And if so, has any of you changed sides or at least had less hatred for Iron Man/Tony Stark's views on that series. Nope, haven't re-read it in a long while, but my position hasn't changed. In the comic-book world, I was rooting for Cap's team; the underdogs, the rebels, the good guys. Tony's team came across as the goons. In the real world it would be no contest. Cap advocates the freedom of extremely dangerous and unidentified individuals to do as they please, independently of the rule of law, free from any form of responsibility. That is a ridiculous position. I'm not sure that the mandatory registration system put forward by Tony makes much sense either (because where do you draw the line? Is Shang-Chi's proficiency in wushu considered a superpower? Must someone who has no power but owns some hardware -like, say, Colin Furze- register as a super person?) but it's clear that no one is above the law. Punching a villain and causing bodily harm would not be excusable in the real world. Hero : "But... but... It's Modok!!! He wants to conquer the world!" Officer: "Wanting to conquer the world is not illegal. Call 9-1-1 if he ever does something illegal; as for you, you don't have the right to punch someone in the face, especially when their face is pretty much their whole body".
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