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Post by Arthur Gordon Scratch on Apr 2, 2016 3:18:30 GMT -5
Oh, well, I'm sure you could, GL ring or not...or Hal Foster(except he'd just let the guy with the bowl haircut do the heavy lifting)...or Hal Ashby..or Hal Holbrook, or...damn, nobody's named kids 'Hal' in a while, have they?  Well, there's always HAL 9000. (And now we have a collector's item crossover with the Artificial Intelligence thread !) Oh, and one of my favorite directors as a teen, the now underlooked Hal Hartley... |
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Post by Spike-X on Apr 3, 2016 16:58:01 GMT -5
Despite having been scripted by The Original Writer and drawn by the magnificent Brian Bolland, The Killing Joke actually isn't very good.
There, I said it.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Apr 3, 2016 17:14:43 GMT -5
Despite having been scripted by The Original Writer and drawn by the magnificent Brian Bolland, The Killing Joke actually isn't very good. There, I said it. The Original Writer would agree with you. As would I. |
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Post by Prince Hal on Apr 3, 2016 17:32:05 GMT -5
Despite having been scripted by The Original Writer and drawn by the magnificent Brian Bolland, The Killing Joke actually isn't very good. There, I said it. No argument here. I still don't get the joke. What Batman would ever find himself laughing with the Joker? |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Apr 5, 2016 14:42:57 GMT -5
Despite having been scripted by The Original Writer and drawn by the magnificent Brian Bolland, The Killing Joke actually isn't very good. There, I said it. No argument here. I still don't get the joke. What Batman would ever find himself laughing with the Joker? That was my reaction to the book as well. "Er, Bruce, the Joker just crippled Barbara and tortured Gordon. Harsh language and physical violence would be more appropriate at this moment in time than this awkward bonding and shared hilarity". |
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Post by Icctrombone on Apr 5, 2016 15:45:27 GMT -5
There are some people that think Batman Snapped the Jokers neck in the end.
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Post by Prince Hal on Apr 5, 2016 15:48:34 GMT -5
No argument here. I still don't get the joke. What Batman would ever find himself laughing with the Joker? That was my reaction to the book as well. "Er, Bruce, the Joker just crippled Barbara and tortured Gordon. Harsh language and physical violence would be more appropriate at this moment in time than this awkward bonding and shared hilarity". Right. And to me, the whole scene with Barbara Gordon was torture-porn or violence-porn or whatever you want to call it. I will say that the scenes of Joker's theretofore unrevealed married life had possibilities, but the wheels went flying off this buggy very quickly. And is this now "in continuity"? Barbara Gordon became wheelchair-bound and took on the role of Oracle as a result of this attack? I'm guessing that the Joker never was properly punished for this, because he apparently was able to slice off his own face, right? As you can see, I ain't been much for new comics for a long time.  |
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Post by Icctrombone on Apr 5, 2016 16:02:15 GMT -5
Once comics became " not for children anymore" you had to expect very violent books and scenes to make it's way into those pages. Watchmen, Preacher and the rest have directed their stories to the aging fan and that includes rape as a possible crime that was never dealt with in the pre- seventies. I read The Boys and it has to be Hands down, the most violent book ever produced.
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Apr 5, 2016 16:03:43 GMT -5
I thought the joke in of itself was amusing. I know I laughed when I read it the first time.
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Post by Prince Hal on Apr 5, 2016 16:13:59 GMT -5
I thought the joke in of itself was amusing. I know I laughed when I read it the first time. Yeah, I was speaking more of the title and underlying theme. |
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Post by Prince Hal on Apr 5, 2016 16:25:47 GMT -5
Once comics became " not for children anymore" you had to expect very violent books and scenes to make it's way into those pages. Watchmen, Preacher and the rest have directed their stories to the aging fan and that includes rape as a possible crime that was never dealt with in the pre- seventies. I read The Boys and it has to be Hands down, the most violent book ever produced. Yeah, I get that, if those subjects are handled with care, in an adult way and not inserted for shock value, which almost immediately has no value. Most of the time, I've found the treatments of rape and violence prurient and misogynistic. And many "creators" use the cover provided by the term "adult" to indulge themselves rather than to inspire thought in their readers. It's like the people who complain that they can't call other people (fill in racial slur)s or hurl other insults around because it wouldn't be politically correct. They just want to have permission to befoul the air with their hate and seize upon political correctness as the bogeyman. What they call politically correct is what most of us call respect, courtesy, and politeness. |
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Apr 5, 2016 16:37:45 GMT -5
I thought the joke in of itself was amusing. I know I laughed when I read it the first time. Yeah, I was speaking more of the title and underlying theme. It never really wowed me, outside of being the first "adult" comic I bought when I discovered it's existence. I think I've read it maybe once more. But, I was early into comics, and not invested as much as other with years reading it and then picking that up and seeing it's contents. |
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Post by Spike-X on Apr 5, 2016 16:38:13 GMT -5
That was my reaction to the book as well. "Er, Bruce, the Joker just crippled Barbara and tortured Gordon. Harsh language and physical violence would be more appropriate at this moment in time than this awkward bonding and shared hilarity". Right. And to me, the whole scene with Barbara Gordon was torture-porn or violence-porn or whatever you want to call it. It was horrible. The whole book was just ghastly and unpleasant and not enjoyable to read. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Apr 5, 2016 16:39:44 GMT -5
Once comics became " not for children anymore" you had to expect very violent books and scenes to make it's way into those pages. Watchmen, Preacher and the rest have directed their stories to the aging fan and that includes rape as a possible crime that was never dealt with in the pre- seventies. I read The Boys and it has to be Hands down, the most violent book ever produced. Yeah, I get that, if those subjects are handled with care, in an adult way and not inserted for shock value, which almost immediately has no value. Most of the time, I've found the treatments of rape and violence prurient and misogynistic. And many "creators" use the cover provided by the term "adult" to indulge themselves rather than to inspire thought in their readers. It's like the people who complain that they can't call other people (fill in racial slur)s or hurl other insults around because it wouldn't be politically correct. They just want to have permission to befoul the air with their hate and seize upon political correctness as the bogeyman. What they call politically correct is what most of us call respect, courtesy, and politeness. I agree. Most of this stuff will be just as effective Off panel rather than showing every straining face and leg. Sheesh. |
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Post by Arthur Gordon Scratch on Apr 5, 2016 17:16:17 GMT -5
The boys is the first Ennis Series I quit before the ending (6 issues in actually...). I didn't like it because it was stupid, not because of the graphic shock value. I disagree that extreme violence in comics is just as effective off panel. In some cases it might, but we're in a graphic medium : if a good artist decides to depict extreme graphic violence, it is still an artistic choice. Art can be unpleasent and sometimes should.  I find it rather scary the current trend to dismiss works such as The Killing Joke. It sure is questionable, but so is all good art. Alan Moore rejects it? Big deal, he also rejects Watchmen! The fact that you use an expression (torture porn) to depict it that didn't even exist back then but has since come to use in relation of far more disgusting and violent pictures than the ones depicted in The Killing Jokes is a dishonnest association, as it triggers feelings associated with actual "torture porn" "stuff". I understand the rejection of the work, I'm myself not its biggest fan. But I will recognize that as a work of its time it had huge merits, great art, eerie ending, and developed the backstory of batman in new ways, even if that only was for an elseworld. When I read it, I felt it as a batman story, not as an elseworld story... |
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