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Post by Batflunkie on Jul 12, 2022 15:16:20 GMT -5
I didn't realize this was JMD's first issue! Great opening arc! Yeah, like I said, it's a doozy! I think the ending to the arc is fantastic, but we'll get to that shortly
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,051
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Post by Confessor on Jul 12, 2022 19:24:52 GMT -5
Part 1: Celluloid Heroes (#261) Plot: Our story opens with Steve, Josh (Steve's Neighbor), and Sam sharing a few laughs and maybe a few too many pitchers of "the devil's nectar". After they leave, Sam & Steve spy some muggers and race into action; though being heavily inebriated hinders them a little. Next morning, Sam & Steve go to the Avenger's Mansion for a work out session. What they failed to notice was an inconspicuous bag lady who radios their actions to one Lyle Dekker aka Ameridroid ("what could he be up to?" we wonder). In the stately residence bought and paid for by the incomprehensively wealthy Tony Stark, Sam reads a letter to Steve about a little studio called "Galactic Pictures" who want to write and produce a Captain America movie. Steve, ever flattered, rejects such an idea out principle. But then Vision alerts Steve a very interesting sight on the tv; It's man in full costume saving a woman from an explosion caused by an organization called the Nihilist Order. And this man's name? Nomad. After reflecting on his past of what sired and what later lead to his disavowing of the Nomad identity, Cap boards a plane to Galactic Pictures. It's not much later that he's caught in the crossfire of both the media-hound Nomad and the ever scheming Nihilist Order. While Nomad is hyping himself up, Cap is greeted by a rep who shepherds him back to the studio. Meanwhile, we resume our nefarious goings on with Dekker who is greeted by his "teacher", who proceeds to chastise one of the Nihilist Order for not doing their job properly. The Master hooks Dekker up to a machine and we recount his backstory. Back at Galactic Pictures, an imprompto press meeting is held and immediately goes awry thanks in part to the Nihilist Order. Cap jumps in to save the day, but he shield veers off, almost hitting a woman before Nomad jumps in. Cap thanks Nomad for the assist and Nomad swings off for parts unknown. Back at the Nihilist Order complex, the Teacher and Dekker meet Nomad, who claims that Cap is just too much for him and the Teacher slaps him across the room. Cap will rue the day he crossed paths with them, the teacher mutters (paraphrasing) and our story ends To Be Continued... Overall Thoughts: A pretty good start to DeMatteis' run, full of action and intrigue that would not be lost on seasoned readers of the title. Zeck's art is great and adds an element of "cartoonish realism" that I always chased after in my own drawing days years ago Not gonna lie: I was hoping for a bit more "meat" to your reviews. I can find a synopsis of this issue elsewhere online, but your thoughts and comments are what make your review thread unique. That's totally your call though, of course, and I don't mean to be overly critical: I'm just happy you've undertaken this project. Hopefully, we can get some good "meaty" discussion going. I didn't care much for Quickdraw Studios' inking on the early issues of this run. GCD says inkers on this issue included Frank McLaughlin, Vince Colletta, and possibly Chic Stone and Al Milgrom. The production assistant character, Wally Lombego, was named after a pseudonym DeMatteis had used a few months earlier, when his script for Star Wars #46 was tampered with. linkHa! You beat me to it regarding the Wally Lombego thing. Thanks for linking to my review of SW #46 though, chaykinstevens. I appreciate it. OK, the very beginning of this issue, in which Steve Rogers and Sam Wilson are shown drunk in a nightclub before they sort out a couple of petty muggers is a weird one. I mean, I didn't hate it, but it just seems a bit odd for a writer to start off his run on Captain America by showing him pissed! It's nice that the Falcon is shown partnering up with Steve in the early part of the book; it appears from the comments Sam makes as if Cap and the Falcon haven't been working as a team much recently? Is having them both adventuring together something that DeMatteis wanted to re-introduce in his run? While we're on the subject of Sam, can he actually understand Redwing the falcon's squawks? He certainly appears to on page 6. The recap about Steve's time as Nomad was good and very useful, since that's not a period of Cap's history I'm at all familiar with. Also, the hapless female TV star that the fake Nomad rescues in the TV News broadcast being named "Suzanne D'Immbulb" made me chortle. As for the villains, Ameridroid and the fake Nomad both seem rather underwhelming. The identity of the hooded "Teacher" is pretty intriguing (no spoilers, please), but the Nihilist Order themselves are ridiculous! I mean, more ridiculous than most real-life terrorist organisations, even. Their battle cries of, "Death to all symbols of everything!" and "Order through disorder!" are unintentionally hilarious – like something out of a Monty Python sketch! I like Mike Zeck's artwork a lot, and I did back as a kid when this run was coming out (though I only bought two issues of it off of the racks: #272 and #282). Zeck's clean lines and photo-realistic approach have something of a John Byrne influence to my eyes, but the faces are pure Zeck. He also handles the action sequences in this issue very well too. I also didn't find the hodge-podge of different inkers that worked on this comic to be particularly bothersome. All in all, I thought this was a fairly entertaining start to J.M. DeMatteis's run, and I'm certainly intrigued enough to read the next issue.
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Post by Batflunkie on Jul 12, 2022 20:38:24 GMT -5
Not gonna lie: I was hoping for a bit more "meat" to your reviews. I can find a synopsis of this issue elsewhere online, but your thoughts and comments are what make your review thread unique. That's totally your call though, of course, and I don't mean to be overly critical: I'm just happy you've undertaken this project. Hopefully, we can get some good "meaty" discussion going. I'm still kind of new to this whole review thread thing, even though I've started and given up on more than I care to remember. Mentally, my mind goes back to my school days giving book reports and all that (which is probably why I've abandoned so many, they feel more like work than fun)
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Post by badwolf on Jul 12, 2022 20:39:51 GMT -5
Sam is telepathically linked to Redwing, isn't he?
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Post by badwolf on Jul 12, 2022 20:41:27 GMT -5
Not gonna lie: I was hoping for a bit more "meat" to your reviews. I can find a synopsis of this issue elsewhere online, but your thoughts and comments are what make your review thread unique. That's totally your call though, of course, and I don't mean to be overly critical: I'm just happy you've undertaken this project. Hopefully, we can get some good "meaty" discussion going. I'm still kind of new to this whole review thread thing, even though I've started and given up on more than I care to remember. Mentally, my mind goes back to my school days giving book reports and all that (which is probably why I've abandoned so many, they feel more like work than fun) I have a love/hate relationship with them myself. Once I get going it's fun, but until I start it does feel like a chore...which is why long periods go by between my posts on my own thread.
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Post by Batflunkie on Jul 12, 2022 20:48:25 GMT -5
Sam is telepathically linked to Redwing, isn't he? I speed read and dropped Volume 1 of Cap so often that I have great difficulty remembering minor plot points from some issues. It would not surprise me if that was the case when Skull used the Cosmic Cube on Sam
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Post by codystarbuck on Jul 12, 2022 21:01:01 GMT -5
I was of an age where I was working more and had money, in the summers and I bought this off the stands; possibly while on a vacation to Boston (I know I got one of the issues of this storyline, in Boston). The Nomad stuff was interesting, to me, as I hadn't seen any of the original (later got all of the issues, for a song, while at college). When I first saw the name, my thoughts went to a tv movie adaptation of Edward Everett Hale's The Man Without a Country, about an Army lieutenant who strikes up a friendship with Aaron Burr, them is implicated during Burr's trial for treason. He renounces the country and is sentenced to live imprisonment on naval warships, never to set foot on US soil or hear an item of news from it. No version of Nomad ever explored that concept and the early version was pretty much Cap, disillusioned, but hardly outright rejecting his country. The eventual reveal of the identity of Nomad was quite interesting, from my perspective.
A few writers tried to do political allegories during their time on Cap and it usually fell flat. The Nihilist Order and later Nihilist Command were pretty goofy (and Flag Smasher was just dumb) and stuff like Left Winger and Right Winger just gave me fits of laughter. DeMatteis does a better job later, when Captain America defends the right for idiots to spout hate, under the First Amendment. Cap is better with ideals and principles, rather than philosophical debates of Left and Right or Order and Chaos.
Tghis was also when they kind of brightened up the Nomad costume, as caps original version was all dark blue, and it had a darker tone to its symbol , as well as its look. Adding yellow boots and gloves and highlights brightens things up a bit and suggests "superhero" a bit more.
Given the connection between Lyle Dekker and plots involving movie studios, I have to believe the name was originally chosen because of the Lydecker Brothers, Howard and Theodore, who created special effects for Republic Studios, in serials like The Adv of Captain Marvel and King of the Rocket Men.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,051
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Post by Confessor on Jul 12, 2022 21:28:32 GMT -5
Sam is telepathically linked to Redwing, isn't he? Oh really? That would explain the seeming communication between the two of them seen in this issue.
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Post by chaykinstevens on Jul 13, 2022 2:14:24 GMT -5
This was also when they kind of brightened up the Nomad costume, as caps original version was all dark blue, and it had a darker tone to its symbol , as well as its look. Adding yellow boots and gloves and highlights brightens things up a bit and suggests "superhero" a bit more. Nomad's costume had the yellow boots and gloves whan it was introduced in Captain America #180, but somebody miscoloured it on the cover of that issue.
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Post by codystarbuck on Jul 13, 2022 11:16:17 GMT -5
This was also when they kind of brightened up the Nomad costume, as caps original version was all dark blue, and it had a darker tone to its symbol , as well as its look. Adding yellow boots and gloves and highlights brightens things up a bit and suggests "superhero" a bit more. Nomad's costume had the yellow boots and gloves whan it was introduced in Captain America #180, but somebody miscoloured it on the cover of that issue. Well, it's been a while, as I mostly recall the cover and the cape, which trips him up, in true Incredibles fashion.
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Post by Batflunkie on Jul 13, 2022 14:21:52 GMT -5
It's nice that the Falcon is shown partnering up with Steve in the early part of the book; it appears from the comments Sam makes as if Cap and the Falcon haven't been working as a team much recently? Is having them both adventuring together something that DeMatteis wanted to re-introduce in his run? While we're on the subject of Sam, can he actually understand Redwing the falcon's squawks? He certainly appears to on page 6. The recap about Steve's time as Nomad was good and very useful, since that's not a period of Cap's history I'm at all familiar with. Also, the hapless female TV star that the fake Nomad rescues in the TV News broadcast being named "Suzanne D'Immbulb" made me chortle. As for the villains, Ameridroid and the fake Nomad both seem rather underwhelming. The identity of the hooded "Teacher" is pretty intriguing (no spoilers, please), but the Nihilist Order themselves are ridiculous! I mean, more ridiculous than most real-life terrorist organisations, even. Their battle cries of, "Death to all symbols of everything!" and "Order through disorder!" are unintentionally hilarious – like something out of a Monty Python sketch! I like Mike Zeck's artwork a lot, and I did back as a kid when this run was coming out (though I only bought two issues of it off of the racks: #272 and #282). Zeck's clean lines and photo-realistic approach have something of a John Byrne influence to my eyes, but the faces are pure Zeck. He also handles the action sequences in this issue very well too. I also didn't find the hodge-podge of different inkers that worked on this comic to be particularly bothersome. All in all, I thought this was a fairly entertaining start to J.M. DeMatteis's run, and I'm certainly intrigued enough to read the next issue. I think Cap went on as a solo book after Kirby left for the second time? And yes? I think Sam can understand Redwing to an extent, he did train birds (mainly pidgeons I think) in his younger years I actually don't mind Ameridroid, Fake-Nomad, The Teacher, or The Nihilist Order. Kind of gives the arc a larger-than-life feel, which makes sense in the context of Cap going away to film a movie
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Post by Batflunkie on Jul 13, 2022 14:54:40 GMT -5
Part 2: Death Of A Legend? (#262) ^Now that's a heck of a cover if I've ever seen one. Hell, they even pasted it on the back of the "Dawn's Early Light" Epic CollectionPlot: We open with a news report by a Geraldo Rivera wannabe that covers the battle between Cap and Nomad & The Nihilist Order from last issue, but it's twisted in such a "Dirty Laundry" way that skews it in Nomad's favor and tries to make Cap seem glory-hounding and foolish. The report is cut off mid-sentence by a disgusted Leonard Spellman, head of Galactic Pictures, who wants to show Cap something. It's a scrapbook filled with old news articles about Cap from over the years that he held onto for inspiration. Years ago, Leonard was deep in the cover of battle against Skull, when out of nowhere, Cap came charging in and saved the day
"So Don't Let The Fickle Crowds Get You Down," Leonard says, "And Don't Let Glory Hounds Like Nomad Dissuade You. The Mundane Adventurers Come And Go, But There Will Always Be--There Must Always Be--A Captain America." Well sir, such a moving account and such a speech moved Cap in such a way that how can he possibly say no to such to film overbubbling with passion? Meanwhile, back at the headquarters of the Nihilist Order, The Teacher chastises Nomad for his incompetency. We learn that Nomad is nothing more than a stunt-man named Eddie Ferbel with delusions of grandeur such as acting (Maybe having a name like "Eddie Ferbel" is what did him in? Who's to say?). We sense that maybe taking up the mantle of Nomad he can prove to himself and the world that he's got what it takes. This is not lost on Dekker or The Teacher, who are merely using him as a pawn. Cap does a bit of promotion for the movie, all the while trying to hunt down the Nihilist Order. It's at one such venue that he catches them in the act, but not before Nomad swoops in. The Nihilist Order regroup days later and sabotage a parade set up in Cap's honor for the movie. But in the midsts of things, Nomad is shot and Cap is captured. Cap wakes up hours later in the presence of Dekker and the Teacher who seek to film the final hours of Captain America. Cap tries to reason with Dekker, briefly breaking the Teacher's programming, but The Teacher is not unprepared. With a lengthy monologue that would make even the most seasoned Bond Villain blush, the Teacher removes his cloak and we get to who he really is And honestly, is it any surprise? It's the bastion of all that is evil himself, Johann Schmidt. But better known to you and I as The Red Skull! To Be Concluded...Overall Thoughts: This issue was quite the read, building on the foundation of the previous issue and leading us down the path of the epic conclusion. I was actually rather surprised at the reveal the first time I read it, Skull had been out the picture for quite some time and it was nice to see him pop back up again
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Post by badwolf on Jul 13, 2022 15:22:17 GMT -5
This may have been the first Red Skull story I read, apart from his origin in Bring on the Bad Guys.
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Post by chaykinstevens on Jul 13, 2022 15:23:04 GMT -5
OK, the very beginning of this issue, in which Steve Rogers and Sam Wilson are shown drunk in a nightclub before they sort out a couple of petty muggers is a weird one. I mean, I didn't hate it, but it just seems a bit odd for a writer to start off his run on Captain America by showing him pissed! DeMatteis might not have known at this point that he would become the regular Cap writer. I think he said the initial arc was reworked from an aborted a one-shot tabloid-sized tie-in to a Cap TV movie.
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Post by Batflunkie on Jul 13, 2022 15:35:21 GMT -5
This may have been the first Red Skull story I read, apart from his origin in Bring on the Bad Guys. Skull has always been a favorite of mine. It felt like he was utilized less once Kirby left the first time, taking a backseat to newer villains of the month. He kind of had something of reputation not unlike Death from Judge Dredd, where he's still viewed as the main baddy, even if he isn't always there OK, the very beginning of this issue, in which Steve Rogers and Sam Wilson are shown drunk in a nightclub before they sort out a couple of petty muggers is a weird one. I mean, I didn't hate it, but it just seems a bit odd for a writer to start off his run on Captain America by showing him pissed! DeMatteis might not have known at this point that he would become the regular Cap writer. I think he said the initial arc was reworked from an aborted a one-shot tabloid-sized tie-in to a Cap TV movie. In the back of Dawn's Early Light, it has some talking points from Stern where he says that he had a three-part story involving Skull in mind before Shooter told him to do less continuous arcs and he left. Always wondered if the three-parter was reworked by DeMatteis into this one Also, Confessor , didn't somebody mention that Steve metabolizes alcohol faster so that it's kind of impossible for him to get drunk?
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