Crimebuster
CCF Podcast Guru
Making comics!
Posts: 3,958
|
Post by Crimebuster on Dec 20, 2020 12:42:12 GMT -5
shaxper said, Let's talk Spider-Man. I'm not a fan. I get the appeal; I really do, and I've tried to read the Lee/Ditko run three times now and always get too bored to push through it. I also read the issues that were coming out when I was an adolescent in the late '80s and early '90s. I liked the wise-cracking and frequent guest appearances well enough, but none of it wowed me, especially once McFarlane got control.It's like you totally read my mind. I get bored reading the early Spider-man books. The only Ditko issue I liked was #8 where Peter punches out Flash Thompson. I did like the 80's issues with Hobgoblin and the PPSS issues, but that's about it. I'm not a Spider-man fan ether, but I have to say that for me, the Ditko-Lee issues are genius. When I was doing my readthrough (via reprints) it was actually a bit into the Romita era where they lost me. The melodrama started being laid on so thick I couldn't take it any longer.
|
|
Crimebuster
CCF Podcast Guru
Making comics!
Posts: 3,958
|
Post by Crimebuster on Dec 20, 2020 12:54:41 GMT -5
5. Craig BoldmanAnother day, another Archie writer. Craig Boldman lands on my list because he was the primary writer for the last 15 years or so of Jughead volume 2. All apologies to all the other great Archie writers and teams, but for me, the team of Boldman and artist Rex W. Lindsay put together the best Jughead run ever. The series was actually at its best when it was cancelled. I loved his introduction of Trula Twyst as a new fremeny for Jughead, and he had some great storylines - "A Jughead in the Family," which technically isn't a classic yet since it came out 9 years ago, is probably my favorite, but there were a lot of great ones before that. I'm going to cheat and use an image from my favorite of his, even though it's newer than 10 years - but almost all of the rest of his run qualifies. From #211, where Jughead crashes at Reggie's house for awhile, with each waiting for the other to strike
|
|
|
Post by Icctrombone on Dec 20, 2020 12:55:39 GMT -5
shaxper said, Let's talk Spider-Man. I'm not a fan. I get the appeal; I really do, and I've tried to read the Lee/Ditko run three times now and always get too bored to push through it. I also read the issues that were coming out when I was an adolescent in the late '80s and early '90s. I liked the wise-cracking and frequent guest appearances well enough, but none of it wowed me, especially once McFarlane got control.It's like you totally read my mind. I get bored reading the early Spider-man books. The only Ditko issue I liked was #8 where Peter punches out Flash Thompson. I did like the 80's issues with Hobgoblin and the PPSS issues, but that's about it. I'm not a Spider-man fan ether, but I have to say that for me, the Ditko-Lee issues are genius. When I was doing my readthrough (via reprints) it was actually a bit into the Romita era where they lost me. The melodrama started being laid on so thick I couldn't take it any longer. I was binge reading the Romita books via Marvel Unlimited and it got to be too repetitive for me, also.
|
|
|
Post by EdoBosnar on Dec 20, 2020 13:54:03 GMT -5
5. Chris ClaremontClaremont used to be my favorite comics writer, bar none. In the past 10 or so years, I’ve gone back and read most of his work that I loved so much when I was much younger, and I noticed many of his shortcomings as a writer. However, I was also surprised that so much of it still resonated with me, and I also found that I just plain old enjoyed reading a lot of his best work. I think his legendary run on X-men in particular still holds up quite well – although personally I’d say the best of the best here is the stretch from when his tenure began in X-men #94 through the departure of Byrne and Austin on art chores (#143). It’s such a perfect mix of superhero action, mutant melodrama and soap opera. Just check out this single page in issue #122, featuring a discussion of urban poverty and the latest installment in Scott’s topsy-turvey love-life. And, of course, the Hellfire/Dark Phoenix saga still packs a punch, while 'Days of Future Past' is one of best two-part stories ever. Besides X-men, I've also really enjoyed the less weighty fare in Claremont’s run on Marvel Team-up, especially #79 ( the Red Sonja team-up that I included in last year’s 12 days) and the four-part amnesiac Black Widow story in #s 82-85.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2020 14:57:28 GMT -5
On the eighth day of Christmas, Santa brought to me the works of Warren Ellis... I really struggled whether to include Ellis on this list this year. In ears past he would have been a slam dunk, but recent revelations about his actions towards woman have moved him from a "glorious bastard" to just a plain bastard in my estimation, but if I look at his body of work and how many of them are perennial favorites of mine, not including him would have been disingenuous. Works that garnered him favorite status: I actually started out as a bigger fan of Ellis as a columnist than as a comic writer, but I came to be a fan of his comic stuff as well, including: Planetary, Authority, Stormwatch, Global Frequency, Hellstrom, Druid, Dr. Strange, Iron Man: Extremis, Transmetropolitan, Orbiter, Fell, Ministry of Space, Red, Gravel, Strange Kiss and sequels, Crecy, Ultraforce and others (including many too recent to include) Why I like his work: Ellis is one of the few "big idea" writers that is honest and acknowledges his influence rather than being Dan Brown like and trying to pass off things they found in sources outside comics as their own brilliant inspiration, and he's one of the few that can actually execute ideas into stories without resorting to wooden plot puppets wo have no intrinsic character traits but only exist to serve the plot and big idea. And while none of his characters are paragons of virtue, many are likeable and all are at least interesting in some way. You usually get an interesting well-crafted story with memorable characters when you read an Ellis comic. Single work I would recommend to someone unfamiliar with his work: Crecy -M
|
|
|
Post by Paste Pot Paul on Dec 20, 2020 15:37:29 GMT -5
5. Pat Mills Judge Dredd, Flesh, Ro-Busters, ABC Warriors, Nemesis The Warlock, Slaine, Charlie's War, and Hook Jaw
That right there is the all-time wish fulfilment lineup for 2000AD, the greatest war comic ever, and the most unlikely hero of all. I was 12 when the best British comic ever hit the stands, Action had it all including 2 of the most violent strips of all, Spinball(I wish I could include this in the above strips) and Hook Jaw an unabashed riff on Jaws which was terrifying audiences for generations to come. A strip about an unstoppable Great White Shark devouring its way through some very foolish divers/swimmers/fishermen. Pure gold. In 2000AD Mills gave us the incredible Cursed earth story in Judge Dredd, based on Zelazny's Damnation Alley it was the first Dredd epic, leading the way for the Judge Child, the Apocalypse War, Necropolis and so so many others. Flesh, mining the Pre-Historic past for meat to feed the starving future...well thats not going to go wrong is it? Ro-Busters were essentially The Thunderbirds, and eventually evolved into the ABC Warriors, the futuristic robotic combat team. Nemesis took a throwaway story and evolved it into an anarchic battle with organised religion/politics, with Kevin O'Neil and Brian Talbot among the artists. Finally he gave us Slaine the Celtic warrior, always more than just a Conan clone, this warp spasming, head lopping, dwarf beater soon evolved into an exploration of celtic mythos(probably a lot more fictional than I know, but hey...) which is still running strong to this day. As mentioned before, those stories from your early teens, your prime comic years, seem to be the ones that resonate the most through the years. While I read a bazillion superhero books then, I was also lucky enough to be exposed to the variety of the British weeklies, Mad, the war digests(British books like Commando), Look and Learn(for a weekly Trigan Empire fix), and more. Mills wrote so many of the stories/strips that even 40 years later I consider to be the most enjoyable(as opposed to BEST) Ive ever read. Sure, there are better written books(now and then) but for one person to give you such a variety of memorable memories(now thats clunky writing) is an accomplishment to be appauded.
|
|
Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,199
|
Post by Confessor on Dec 20, 2020 19:29:33 GMT -5
Jeez, what's with all the Spider-Man negativity? Listen, it's like this: Lee/Ditko Spider-Man made for some absolutely fantastic comics, but Lee/Romita Spider-Man is more accessible, but ultimately just as rewarding, if not moreso. For me, Spider-Man is so superior to everything else that Marvel published in the Silver Age that it's almost beyond criticism. Certainly when compared to the likes of Fantastic Four, Thor or Daredevil, it's by far the most grounded, "realistic" and entertaining of Marvel's Silver Age output. If you think you don't like Silver Age era Spider-Man comics, you need to admit to yourself that you are wrong and re-read some Lee/Ditko or Lee/Romita comics as soon as you can.
|
|
|
Post by Icctrombone on Dec 20, 2020 20:00:14 GMT -5
Jeez, what's with all the Spider-Man negativity? Listen, it's like this: Lee/Ditko Spider-Man made for some absolutely fantastic comics, but Lee/Romita Spider-Man is more accessible, but ultimately just as rewarding, if not moreso. For me, Spider-Man is so superior to everything else that Marvel published in the Silver Age that it's almost beyond criticism. Certainly when compared to the likes of Fantastic Four, Thor or Daredevil, it's by far the most grounded, "realistic" and entertaining of Marvel's Silver Age output. If you think you don't like Silver Age era Spider-Man comics, you need to admit to yourself that you are wrong and re-read some Lee/Ditko or Lee/Romita comics as soon as you can. Not negative on my part. I enjoyed the 80's Stern books.
|
|
|
Post by MDG on Dec 20, 2020 20:39:54 GMT -5
Al Feldstein
In the great book of comics, I think Feldstein should go down as a great editor, rather than as a writer or artist, but for someone who had to turn out "a story a day," Feldstein kept the quality pretty high, especially compared to a lot of other comic book writing of the period. And since so much was formula—and it was—finding narrative like first or second person (or narration by a grave) kept stories fresh when read in limited quantity at a sitting.
Looking at them today, I'm struck more by the cynical, negative, sometimes paranoid tone than the images of rotting corpses, but it's an important and influential oeuvre in comics. Plus, he wrote the scripts in pencil directly on the boards without a script, laying it out panel-by-panel as he went.
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Dec 21, 2020 0:44:02 GMT -5
Jeez, what's with all the Spider-Man negativity? Listen, it's like this: Lee/Ditko Spider-Man made for some absolutely fantastic comics, but Lee/Romita Spider-Man is more accessible, but ultimately just as rewarding, if not moreso. For me, Spider-Man is so superior to everything else that Marvel published in the Silver Age that it's almost beyond criticism. Certainly when compared to the likes of Fantastic Four, Thor or Daredevil, it's by far the most grounded, "realistic" and entertaining of Marvel's Silver Age output. If you think you don't like Silver Age era Spider-Man comics, you need to admit to yourself that you are wrong and re-read some Lee/Ditko or Lee/Romita comics as soon as you can. I have and haven't warmed to the character much, beyond MTU and a few other things. Basically, my issues are the incessant whining that came with the soap opera and a certain level of self-loathing that kind of comes through in it. You can call it characterization, you can call it mature; to me, it gets annoying and a big reason why Spidey was never more than a minor part of my collection. That's not to say I don't have favorite Spidey stories, or that he is a bad character; but, he just doesn't appeal to me. I can take him more in MTU portions and a few stories where the trickster element is the strongest, rather than the soap opera. personally, I never thought the soap opera was that good. Still, that's why ice cream comes in different flavor. Some people like chocolate, some just want pistachio rabbit.
|
|
|
Post by foxley on Dec 21, 2020 2:15:57 GMT -5
5. Dennis (Denny) O'NeilOthers have already the praises of the late Mr. O'Neil, so there is probably little I can add save some personal observations. He is justly famous for his work of Green Lantern/Green Arrow, and with my comic historian hat on I can see why it was groundbreaking at the time. But reading it with modern eyes, it feels a trifle overwrought (and conveys the unfortunate impression that heroin addiction can be bested in one night). However, Denny was instrumental in transforming GA from a wishy-washy Batman clone into a dynamic social crusader, and laid the groundwork for what later writers like Mike Grell would do. So his work in turning Ollie into one of my favourite characters is a definite tick in my book. Aging better (IMO) is his work on Batman. Much ink has been spent on analysing his run on the Caped Crusader, which I do not intend to rehash here. Suffice he say he introduced characters and concepts that are still integral to Batman today, such as "Matches" Malone, and Ra's al Ghul and Talia. But what gives him a spot as high as #5 on my list is his work on The Question with Denys Cowan. This was a book that was 'adult' in all of the best senses of the word. I tried to read a few issues of this book when it first came out in my teens, but it just didn't click with me. Years later, in my 30s, I started putting together full runs of various DC titles from the 1980s in an attempt to relive my youth. One of them was The Question, and suddenly I got it. I needed the maturity and life experience for it to resonate with me. I would never have guessed that super-heroics and philosophy could mesh so well, but it did. This was a book that did not pull its punches, but not also did not insult its readers intelligence. And it is the only comic I know of that came with its own suggested reading list to help you explore the themes of the issue.
|
|
|
Post by Slam_Bradley on Dec 21, 2020 11:05:27 GMT -5
5. John Ostrander (Spectre, Grimjack, The Kents, Blaze of Glory, etc.) Mine are pretty well reruns from here on out. So whatcha gonna do? Ostrander, started out writing at first, taking over Starslayer from Grell, working on Warp and Mars, but he really came in to his own with Grimjack, one of the best SF comic books...ever. He's gone on to be, in my opinion, the most consistent writer of Big Two comics in the last 40 years. With The Kents and Blaze of Glory he proved that he could write westerns with the very best. And he provided us with the very best version of The Spectre ever, and made Jim Corrigan one of my favorite characters. Add in great runs on Suicide Squad, Martian Manhunter, Hawkworld, and Heroes For Hire and you have a damn fine career.
|
|
|
Post by EdoBosnar on Dec 21, 2020 11:54:06 GMT -5
Jeez, what's with all the Spider-Man negativity? (...) Forget it, Jaxxon. It's Chinatown...
|
|
|
Post by Slam_Bradley on Dec 21, 2020 12:21:06 GMT -5
Random thoughts on Day 8.
Len Wein - Of the writers who were super active when I started Wein may be the one whose work holds up the best for me. Swamp Thing still holds up well. His run on Amazing Spider-Man holds up well (I think). But with someone that prolific, it's hard to say.
Richard Pini - I've only read a handful of issues of Elfquest. So many comics...so little time.
Jim Shooter - I'll admit that I remember a lot of his run on Avengers fondly. But trying to get past the dumpster fire that was Secret Wars along with his toxic personality is probably more than I can handle.
Karl Kesel - I like Section Zero well enough. Beyond that I've only read a handful of books he's written.
Craig Boldman - I got nuthin'.
Al Feldstein - Feldstein would be very high on my list of greatest editors. The fact that he took over Mad and that it flourished in his hands is testament to that. As a writer I'd say solid, but not top tier.
|
|
|
Post by berkley on Dec 21, 2020 22:08:56 GMT -5
On the eighth day of Christmas, Santa brought to me the works of Warren Ellis... Why I like his work: Ellis is one of the few "big idea" writers that is honest and acknowledges his influence rather than being Dan Brown like and trying to pass off things they found in sources outside comics as their own brilliant inspiration, and he's one of the few that can actually execute ideas into stories without resorting to wooden plot puppets wo have no intrinsic character traits but only exist to serve the plot and big idea. And while none of his characters are paragons of virtue, many are likeable and all are at least interesting in some way. You usually get an interesting well-crafted story with memorable characters when you read an Ellis comic. -M
Yeah, this is what makes Ellis (and in a similar way Morrsion) stand out to me in contrast to some more recent comics writers, e.g. Hickman, who it often seems to me have not assimilated the scientific or philosophical ideas they try to use in their comics, or at least have not been able to introduce those ideas in an organic, seamless way that doesn't make the reader feel they've been shoehorned into the story because the witer wants to show how smart and well-read they are.
Perhaps that's unfair - and I know that many readers feel exactly the same way about Ellis himself - but I see a big difference, and it comes trictly from reading the comics themselves not from anything outside or any impression of the creators involved gained from interviews or articles or what have you.
|
|