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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 12, 2019 14:43:31 GMT -5
This also featured the debut of Wolverine's brown costume, which, if memory serves, led to a conversation to the effect of "What's with the new outfit?" "Just 'cause!"
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Post by badwolf on Jun 12, 2019 15:27:13 GMT -5
This also featured the debut of Wolverine's brown costume, which, if memory serves, led to a conversation to the effect of "What's with the new outfit?" "Just 'cause!" With all the fracas I forgot to mention that.
Why not indeed!
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Post by rberman on Jun 12, 2019 15:49:35 GMT -5
So much went right with issue #139, it's not even funny. Claremont and Byrne were firing on all cylinders. We get tons of characterizations: - Angel being rusty at teamwork. Wolverine is actually encouraging to him, saying some practice will have him back where he ought to be in no time. - Kurt recognizes that Kitty is trying hard not to be be freaked out by his appearance. Byrne wanted her reaction to be the occasion of Kurt having darker feelings, but Claremont went the opposite way. - Wolverine mockingly calling Xavier "Charlie" and "Chuck." He gets his new Byrne-designed brown costume. "Why not?" The brown makes a lot more sense than yellow for a hunter/assassin. - Wolverine's name "Logan" revealed, as well as his long-time friendship with Mac and Heather, which was handled warmly, humanizing this former berserker. - Heather has center-parted hair, a pony tail, and big glasses (all unsexy) but also goes grocery shopping in a thigh-flashing skirt slit up to the hip (suggesting she's secretly sexy as well as shapely). - Shaman and Snowbird hanging about in their civvies. It always bugs me to see heroes wearing their costumes around the house. - Nightcrawler and Snowbird being impressed with each other's powers. "How does she do that/How does he do that?" - A Scooby-Doo slapstick moment when Snowbird's alarming appearance causes Nightcrawler's hair to stand on end, and he climbs on top of Wolverine like a scared chimp. - Kitty expresses particular concern that Peter will be hurt in the danger room. Kitty tells Ororo that she's a genius intellect, which Claremont wanted but Byrne very much did not. Also, Claremont won the argument that Kitty's code name would be "Sprite" and not "Ariel," which is a Jewish boy's name. - First appearance of Stevie Hunter, and a hint of a tragic past. - Kurt shows religiosity, praying to God for insight as to why Jean Grey died. - We were discussing in the " Dark Phoenix: Autopsy" thread how Kurt and Logan's trip to Canada probably had its genesis in a storyline that Claremont and Byrne had intended before Jim Shooter mandated the death of Jean Grey. The separation of Jean and Phoenix (with Jean's survival) would have occasioned the temporary breakup of the X-Men and separate adventures for the team members. Angel would have returned to the team full time, as suggested in this issue.
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Post by badwolf on Jun 12, 2019 16:11:28 GMT -5
All good points R.B.! I feel like I should be more analytical... I'm still kind of new to this.
I'm sure I've mentioned more than once that this story is my favorite X-Men story (followed closely by the next one.) I was pretty new to the series but Wolverine and Nightcrawler had already become my favorites on the team. A buddy trip featuring the two of them? Yes please! This was my introduction to Alpha Flight (I wouldn't get to read the earlier issues until the Classic X-Men reprints) and I was infatuated with Snowbird as well. I love the Canadian woods setting.
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 12, 2019 17:10:39 GMT -5
So much went right with issue #139, it's not even funny. Claremont and Byrne were firing on all cylinders. We get tons of characterizations: - Angel being rusty at teamwork. Wolverine is actually encouraging to him, saying some practice will have him back where he ought to be in no time. - Kurt recognizes that Kitty is trying hard not to be be freaked out by his appearance. Byrne wanted her reaction to be the occasion of Kurt having darker feelings, but Claremont went the opposite way. - Wolverine mockingly calling Xavier "Charlie" and "Chuck." He gets his new Byrne-designed brown costume. "Why not?" The brown makes a lot more sense than yellow for a hunter/assassin. - Wolverine's name "Logan" revealed, as well as his long-time friendship with Mac and Heather, which was handled warmly, humanizing this former berserker. - Heather has center-parted hair, a pony tail, and big glasses (all unsexy) but also goes grocery shopping in a thigh-flashing skirt slit up to the hip (suggesting she's secretly sexy as well as shapely). - Shaman and Snowbird hanging about in their civvies. It always bugs me to see heroes wearing their costumes around the house. - Nightcrawler and Snowbird being impressed with each other's powers. "How does she do that/How does he do that?" - A Scooby-Doo slapstick moment when Snowbird's alarming appearance causes Nightcrawler's hair to stand on end, and he climbs on top of Wolverine like a scared chimp. - Kitty expresses particular concern that Peter will be hurt in the danger room. Kitty tells Ororo that she's a genius intellect, which Claremont wanted but Byrne very much did not. Also, Claremont won the argument that Kitty's code name would be "Sprite" and not "Ariel," which is a Jewish boy's name. - First appearance of Stevie Hunter, and a hint of a tragic past. - Kurt shows religiosity, praying to God for insight as to why Jean Grey died. - We were discussing in the " Dark Phoenix: Autopsy" thread how Kurt and Logan's trip to Canada probably had its genesis in a storyline that Claremont and Byrne had intended before Jim Shooter mandated the death of Jean Grey. The separation of Jean and Phoenix (with Jean's survival) would have occasioned the temporary breakup of the X-Men and separate adventures for the team members. Angel would have returned to the team full time, as suggested in this issue. The hell you say! Guys make passes at girls who wear glasses! I submit exhibits A... (Marcia Strassman, as Julie Kotter) and B... (Jan Smithers, as Bailey Quarters) Seemed pretty obvious to me, where Byrne and Claremont drew inspiration.
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Post by badwolf on Jun 12, 2019 17:14:44 GMT -5
Oops! All good points R.B., except for that one!
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Post by Cei-U! on Jun 12, 2019 17:16:47 GMT -5
This two-parter, and specifically the introduction of Heather Hudson, were why I was so excited about an Alpha solo book by Byrne. It didn't hurt that it also has some of my favorite Nightcrawler moments ever... and Wolverine's infinitely superior brown costume.
Cei-U! I summon the happy memories!
By the way, badwolf, if you'd like me to send you a copy of my Alpha Flight index (it covers the series up through Annual #1), PM me with your e-mail address.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 12, 2019 17:19:03 GMT -5
- Wolverine mockingly calling Xavier "Charlie" and "Chuck." He gets his new Byrne-designed brown costume. "Why not?" The brown makes a lot more sense than yellow for a hunter/assassin. ...or for a wolverine, in fact. The French translated his name as “Serval” in the 70s (a name Gambit called him on occasion), which made the yellow costume more sensible (as servals are yellow cats with very long ears). That brown costume is one of the best designs I’ve ever seen. Why oh why did Jim Lee decide to go back to the yellow thing in the ‘90s???
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 12, 2019 17:19:10 GMT -5
So much went right with issue #139, it's not even funny. Claremont and Byrne were firing on all cylinders. We get tons of characterizations: - Angel being rusty at teamwork. Wolverine is actually encouraging to him, saying some practice will have him back where he ought to be in no time. - Kurt recognizes that Kitty is trying hard not to be be freaked out by his appearance. Byrne wanted her reaction to be the occasion of Kurt having darker feelings, but Claremont went the opposite way. - Wolverine mockingly calling Xavier "Charlie" and "Chuck." He gets his new Byrne-designed brown costume. "Why not?" The brown makes a lot more sense than yellow for a hunter/assassin. - Wolverine's name "Logan" revealed, as well as his long-time friendship with Mac and Heather, which was handled warmly, humanizing this former berserker. - Heather has center-parted hair, a pony tail, and big glasses (all unsexy) but also goes grocery shopping in a thigh-flashing skirt slit up to the hip (suggesting she's secretly sexy as well as shapely). - Shaman and Snowbird hanging about in their civvies. It always bugs me to see heroes wearing their costumes around the house. - Nightcrawler and Snowbird being impressed with each other's powers. "How does she do that/How does he do that?" - A Scooby-Doo slapstick moment when Snowbird's alarming appearance causes Nightcrawler's hair to stand on end, and he climbs on top of Wolverine like a scared chimp. - Kitty expresses particular concern that Peter will be hurt in the danger room. Kitty tells Ororo that she's a genius intellect, which Claremont wanted but Byrne very much did not. Also, Claremont won the argument that Kitty's code name would be "Sprite" and not "Ariel," which is a Jewish boy's name. - First appearance of Stevie Hunter, and a hint of a tragic past. - Kurt shows religiosity, praying to God for insight as to why Jean Grey died. - We were discussing in the " Dark Phoenix: Autopsy" thread how Kurt and Logan's trip to Canada probably had its genesis in a storyline that Claremont and Byrne had intended before Jim Shooter mandated the death of Jean Grey. The separation of Jean and Phoenix (with Jean's survival) would have occasioned the temporary breakup of the X-Men and separate adventures for the team members. Angel would have returned to the team full time, as suggested in this issue. The hell you say! Guys make passes at girls who wear glasses! I submit exhibits A... (Marcia Strassman, as Julie Kotter) and B... (Jan Smithers, as Bailey Quarters) Seemed pretty obvious to me, where Byrne and Claremont drew inspiration. I thought they were the same actress.
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 12, 2019 17:27:44 GMT -5
ps The brown color had less to do with "hunter/assassin" and more to do with the actual coloring of a wolverine's fur... vs a college football team's helmet and team colors...
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Post by beccabear67 on Jun 12, 2019 17:38:40 GMT -5
I guess I'll be the villain in liking the yellow, blue and black costume more, orange and brown I'm not crazy about together, except at A&W Hamburgers franchises, orange for cheese or bun and brown for the burger? I'll have the Wolverine deluxe hold the hair? I bet the Wendigo's burgers are square! No comment on the glasses debate. All women who read comics have coke bottle bottom glasses I read once.
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Post by profh0011 on Jun 12, 2019 17:42:05 GMT -5
HOW MANY long-term problems in some comics series might have been avoided entirely, if only editors had stood up to Keith Giffen this way? Interesting comment, what has Giffen ruined? DR. FATE (via the 4-issue mini-seires) and LEGION OF SUPER-HEROES (a book he should never, ever, EVER be let anywhere near ever again).
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 12, 2019 17:51:00 GMT -5
I though LSH was where he made his fame.
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Post by beccabear67 on Jun 12, 2019 19:33:22 GMT -5
Interesting comment, what has Giffen ruined? DR. FATE (via the 4-issue mini-seires) and LEGION OF SUPER-HEROES (a book he should never, ever, EVER be let anywhere near ever again). There were a lot of readers who seemed to intensely dislike Giffen's work on Hex going solely by the last issue of that comic I have. It seems he was trying to channel Munoz or Pratt or Toth and the Hex readers didn't like panels and sometimes pages where they couldn't tell who some distant blog was meant to be or was it an extreme zoom-in on somebody's chin mole? I remember he did Dr. Fate as a back-up in The Flash, before he found his more abstract blobby style. As a writer he seems to be mostly humorous along the lines of The Tick or Cap'n Quick & A Foozle. Didn't he create Lobo? That's something to hold against him I might say.
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Post by rberman on Jun 12, 2019 22:28:30 GMT -5
Interesting comment, what has Giffen ruined? LEGION OF SUPER-HEROES (a book he should never, ever, EVER be let anywhere near ever again). Interesting outlier opinion. Defend it!
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