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Post by thwhtguardian on Apr 2, 2019 18:55:22 GMT -5
Some personal choices trump the all mighty dollar. I'm not some hot shot writer or artist so maybe my sentiment would change if I actually had some skin in the game but standing right here, right now I'd gladly try my hand at creating a new hero in the hopes that if it caught on I might be thought of as reverently by future fans as I do now when I think of people like Jack Kirby, Joe Kubert, Gil Kane, Gardner Fox or Frank Miller. That's certainly a choice. But reverence doesn't put the kids through college or pay for health care when the corporate behemoth has moved on to the new shiny writer/artist. Yeah...that's probably cynical. But having seen plenty of great creators die penniless it maybe makes some sense to worry more about money. True, like I said it's definitely a personal choice every creator has to make based on their own needs and feelings and they're certainly not obligated to contribute to the sandbox but I definitely see the lure. Also, I definitely think there should be significant rewards for those who do decide to enrich these fictional universes so that they don't end up like the marquee names of yore.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 2, 2019 22:04:08 GMT -5
That's certainly a choice. But reverence doesn't put the kids through college or pay for health care when the corporate behemoth has moved on to the new shiny writer/artist. Yeah...that's probably cynical. But having seen plenty of great creators die penniless it maybe makes some sense to worry more about money. True, like I said it's definitely a personal choice every creator has to make based on their own needs and feelings and they're certainly not obligated to contribute to the sandbox but I definitely see the lure. Also, I definitely think there should be significant rewards for those who do decide to enrich these fictional universes so that they don't end up like the marquee names of yore. It's a different ballgame now though, as self-publishing or creator-owned deals really weren't available to the likes of Siegel, Shuster, Kirby, et. al when they plied their wares in the comic industry. The path to print and to market only went through the big publishers then and they had all the leverage, and had no qualms about using it to take what they wanted form the creators who worked for them for a fraction of their potential worth. The world, and the market has changed since then, and there are work-arounds to reach market that don't go through the corporate comic companies that didn't exist then, and knowing how much regret the likes of Siegel and Kirby expressed about the options available to them later in their lives, one would think they would have taken those work around options rather than sell their babies for a pittance or a regular paycheck. None of them were particularly interested in reverence of fans or legacy, but about maximizing their earning potential and having a path to market for their work. Siegel and Shuster took the path they did because the syndicated newspaper market rejected them, not because they wanted to enrich a fictional universe or contribute to a sandbox. They did so because it was the only way to monetize their work. Had they had other options, they would have taken them, but the only deal available to them was the raw deal they got from National. Kirby was looking for a steady paycheck, and was happy to work for the pay he got, doing the dirty work when things were lean, and he hoped/expected to get a fair share of the credit/reward when times got better, and didn't. Had another option besides staying at Marvel or going to DC been available to him (as it later was with Pacific), he likely would have taken it and done his Fourth World stuff and his other DC and 2nd Marvel term creations on his own terms with his own path to market. But such options didn't present themselves to him until he was in nadir of his career. Today's creators certainly have choices and opportunities not available to creators of yore, but many who choose to work for and create characters for Marvel/DC these days usually aren't doing so primarily to contribute to someone else's sandbox, even if they grew up fans, it's for far more practical reasons. To make the other creator-owned options viable in the current market, you have to have an established customer base, and that comes form having work on the shelves customers can get access to. Doing work for Marvel and DC is going to make it more likely shop owners will order shelf copies (and not just enough copies to meet preorders) of your books to put them out where more customers can discover them, and creating a new character will usually result in higher preorders, more shelf copies, and more chances of getting product int he hands of end customers who will discover (or rediscover in Liefeld's case) your work and follow you to other projects that you own. It's playing a long game in the market, and using Marvel and DC as a marketing avenue for your work to try to build a large enough customer base for your work to make the creator-owned/non-corporate comic route financially viable. Liefeld's star has fallen, and he gets the most attention for stuff he did in the 90s (creation of Cable & Deadpool), and he has a new media deal for his Extreme properties, My guess doing MArvel work is a way to put his name back in the spotlight, and creating a new character will make the spotlight brighter with the ensuing hype and marketing, so that he rebuilds some of that name recognition and some of those customer will follow his name to the new Extreme movies and tv shows when they start to debut in the next few years. Or maybe I am just cynical, but to me, it is the most obvious reason to do something like this for Marvel and DC, a short term sacrifice of ownership on one character for the hope of gaining the long term benefit of audience for all your other characters and properties. -M
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Apr 5, 2019 12:06:42 GMT -5
Or maybe I am just cynical, but to me, it is the most obvious reason to do something like this for Marvel and DC, a short term sacrifice of ownership on one character for the hope of gaining the long term benefit of audience for all your other characters and properties. Particularly when said character is just another dude in spandex shooting guns, one whose sole apparent interesting feature (if it can even be called that) is how he's related to other characters owned by the publisher. I mean, I can't imagine any Conan writer losing any sleep because they won't retain the rights to Zgrbllux, their newly-minted bald wizard in a robe who shoots magic bolts from his hands! Having written Conan, though, looks pretty good on a résumé.
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Post by Icctrombone on Apr 5, 2019 12:23:54 GMT -5
My thinking is that It's nothing character but I thought the same thing about Deadpool.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 14:10:51 GMT -5
My thinking is that It's nothing character but I thought the same thing about Deadpool. Issues not even out yet and Diamond has sold out and Marvel has gone back to do a second printing, so there's some smoke here among the current customer base, but only time will tell if there is any fire to the character and if sales to end customers equal retailer anticipation of such. -M
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Post by Icctrombone on Apr 5, 2019 14:55:10 GMT -5
I’m actually referring to movie potential for his newest creation.
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