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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Feb 20, 2017 9:16:35 GMT -5
I've rarely ever been impressed by action or violence in art, whether in comics or film. Even as a huge fan of horror films, I don't find anything impressive about excessive violence. The most powerful horror films use restraint so that, when violence is portrayed or even suggested, it hits with impact. Otherwise, yes, it desensitizes me, and to the point where it does absolutely nothing for me in terms of entertainment value either. When the newest Star Trek film had twenty minute action scenes with folks dying left and right, I yawned and found my mind wandering. I didn't think about the desensitization at the angle you mention here. It's not that it is not offensive to you, it is just not entertaining, if I am understanding your post correctly. Which I guess I can't really say has happened to me, as I don't want to take part in entertainment that surpasses my ceiling for visual gore. And not so much to your particular post shax, but just in general thinking about the comments people have made ... I think it's the violence itself, along with that amount of over the top gore. Like I mentioned about TWD just being one reprehensible person after another. And as spoon mentioned, it's a pessimistic look at what humanity might do in such a situation. Either further showing that humanity can't past their own prejudices and mistrust, and actually progress as a species. Which reality right now, is enough for me to see the bad things people can do to on another, that I don't want to be entertained by it. What bothers me the most is my friends Children when they play video games that has violence all over the place they became obsessed with it and that alone bothers me when they take actual participation to it and play long hours during the week. I've don't play video games and my nephews do when they were little and when they got older and more wiser - they told me that these games are too violence and felt that it's a total waste of time and monies to spend on. That's my take on it and that's why I feel that video games should teach them more educational stuff and not the violence that comes with it. I agree that most movies (the blockbusters) have way too much violence and I'm having 2nd thoughts about seeing Logan in a week with friends. As far as games, I started out sheltering my boys from what is out there. But I found that their world of video games is very different from the one I grew up with. There was still violence in the games I played, it just wasn't able to be displayed as it is with new technology. So the first Mature rated game they both played was Resident Evil 4 when we got the Wii. And I figured as long as they can separate fiction from reality, it would be okay. As they got older both went their own path with the games they play. My oldest still plays some shooters and more "adult" games, where my youngest is big into Pokemon, Maro & Luigi games and Sonic. Though he still does like playing Resident Evil 4 & 5. Interestingly enough, the only game one of my boys acted out with was Hulk Ultimate Destruction, a Teen rated, sandbox game where literally everything in the city was destructible. And he started to think (he was 5 or 6 then) everything in the house was destructible and almost hurt his baby brother. So that game got shelved for almost a year before we let him play it again, siting the same thing would happen if he acted out again. But he never did. I'm telling you this necessarily to sway you. Just an observation I've made as regards games and how they effect the player. Some of the more violent games will never be for me, but I think as long as the mind recognizes that distinction between fiction and reality, what we do to entertain ourselves should be subject to other people's morals. |
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
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Post by shaxper on Feb 20, 2017 9:23:00 GMT -5
I've rarely ever been impressed by action or violence in art, whether in comics or film. Even as a huge fan of horror films, I don't find anything impressive about excessive violence. The most powerful horror films use restraint so that, when violence is portrayed or even suggested, it hits with impact. Otherwise, yes, it desensitizes me, and to the point where it does absolutely nothing for me in terms of entertainment value either. When the newest Star Trek film had twenty minute action scenes with folks dying left and right, I yawned and found my mind wandering. I didn't think about the desensitization at the angle you mention here. It's not that it is not offensive to you, it is just not entertaining, if I am understanding your post correctly. Which I guess I can't really say has happened to me, as I don't want to take part in entertainment that surpasses my ceiling for visual gore. Violence doesn't offend me so long as it's correctly targeted to the audience and doesn't bring with it any latent prejudice or sexism. When violence is sexualized or used to play up anger at a certain group or person, I get deeply offended. When we're just lopping off heads in a zombie movie with an R rating, I just yawn and decide the director is uncreative. But isn't that the nature of the subgenre? It would be very interesting to see a zombie series where humans are prevailing by working together, but that's not how the Zombie subgenre has ever been used before. TWD isn't taking a bold approach in its pessimism; it's playing it very safe. |
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Feb 21, 2017 15:08:36 GMT -5
But isn't that the nature of the subgenre? It would be very interesting to see a zombie series where humans are prevailing by working together, but that's not how the Zombie subgenre has ever been used before. TWD isn't taking a bold approach in its pessimism; it's playing it very safe. To the point of zombies and TWD; I don't care for zombie movies for that reason. I tried to watch TWD because so many people praised it and said it was more than just about zombies. So I certainly agree that violence should be expected in a show about them. Same reason, as The Captain mentioned Game of Thrones has never been on my radar. But that there is more violence perpetrated by the humans on each other than the zombies? I've only really watched 28 Days Later and Shaun of the Dead, and that is the exact opposite of what the humans did in those movies. Or at least the central group of characters. My wife just texted me this link, which is what reminded me of this thread. I agree with parental responsibility as far as children seeing violence go. I still have my limits. He may play Resident Evil and Dead Space and watch TWD and Zoombies, but there's still no Grand Theft Auto or no reading The Killing Joke or Watchmen at 13 years old: abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/video/walking-dead-premiere-emotional-teen-43028940 |
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Post by junkmonkey on Jun 19, 2017 3:37:03 GMT -5
I always find it disturbing the powers that be (especially American) are quite happy to let film makers in particular show massive amounts of ultra violence but get upset and flustered and clamp down on even heterosexual f*cking on screen. I read the other day that Seven Soderbergs Solaris initially got an R rating in the States because he had the temerity to show a brief (2 or 3 second) shot of George Clooney's arse. It's okay, it seems, to let youngsters watch characters blow other characters' heads off but they had better not do it naked.
I was at a con last year looking through the comics at the creators village area and every comic that I picked up (apart, obviously, from those overtly cute and fluffy autobiographic ones) I flipped open to a page in which someone was getting their brains blown out at close range. I don't know if this is a particularly British thing but it was depressing.
One of the artist creators noted my revulsion and asked me what I was looking for. He had several books on his pitch. "I don't know," I said. "Something without a serial killer in it. I'm so bored with the whole serial killer trope."
"How about this one?" he said, pointing to another of his comics, "It's about an assassin..."
"You mean a paid serial killer?"
"Huh?"
He didn't understand. I didn't buy it.
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Post by badwolf on Jun 19, 2017 10:27:22 GMT -5
I don't have a problem with violence in entertainment as long as it's not gratuitous and the game or movie is good. I thought the latest Doom game was a bit over the top but it didn't "bother" me. I love the new Tomb Raider games; the only thing that bothered me in those were when I had to shoot a deer and didn't get a clean kill, and it would run around yipping until you tracked it down and put it out of its misery. But I think it's good that they put that in. I'm pretty sure it's supposed to disturb the player (and when Lara first has to kill in the first game, it does affect her.)
I don't find any correlation between fantasy and real violence. I'm not desensitized to real violence. I can't bear to watch the news, don't want to see people getting blown up or mowed down in this week's terrorist attack. I don't even like those so-called "prank" shows where people do stupid things to themselves or interfere with people minding their own business in public.
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Jun 19, 2017 11:10:58 GMT -5
I don't have a problem with violence in entertainment as long as it's not gratuitous and the game or movie is good. I thought the latest Doom game was a bit over the top but it didn't "bother" me. I love the new Tomb Raider games; the only thing that bothered me in those were when I had to shoot a deer and didn't get a clean kill, and it would run around yipping until you tracked it down and put it out of its misery. But I think it's good that they put that in. I'm pretty sure it's supposed to disturb the player (and when Lara first has to kill in the first game, it does affect her.) I don't find any correlation between fantasy and real violence. I'm not desensitized to real violence. I can't bear to watch the news, don't want to see people getting blown up or mowed down in this week's terrorist attack. I don't even like those so-called "prank" shows where people do stupid things to themselves or interfere with people minding their own business in public. I actually was disturbed at the violence in Tomb Raider, and initially was put off from it. I went back to it again a few times, and just pushed myself through it, avoid meelee and stealth kills (at least after you get the climber's axe). When I finally got through it, I really enjoyed the actual game play aspects and decided to do another play through. Though this time, I intentionally didn't learn specific skills and avoided the more gruesome melee and stealth kills. And yeah the first in game required animal kill was a good way to express her uneasiness and aversion to violence. And I think this has been brought up in this thread before by other posters; but I think the escalation to what she was willing to do as the game progressed, almost seem counter to her initial aversion to violence. Like the skills that you can learn get more brutal and gruesome, for someone that wasn't wanting to kill in the first place. But I think that speaks more to the fact that violence of a gruesome nature is what constitutes an "adult" game, which goes back to whether or not much of, at least Americans, are desensitized to violence, as developers are only putting this in their games because there is a demand for it and it sells. Also why Nintendo's consoles and games have always been considered "kiddie". |
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Post by badwolf on Jun 19, 2017 11:34:33 GMT -5
I don't have a problem with violence in entertainment as long as it's not gratuitous and the game or movie is good. I thought the latest Doom game was a bit over the top but it didn't "bother" me. I love the new Tomb Raider games; the only thing that bothered me in those were when I had to shoot a deer and didn't get a clean kill, and it would run around yipping until you tracked it down and put it out of its misery. But I think it's good that they put that in. I'm pretty sure it's supposed to disturb the player (and when Lara first has to kill in the first game, it does affect her.) I don't find any correlation between fantasy and real violence. I'm not desensitized to real violence. I can't bear to watch the news, don't want to see people getting blown up or mowed down in this week's terrorist attack. I don't even like those so-called "prank" shows where people do stupid things to themselves or interfere with people minding their own business in public. I actually was disturbed at the violence in Tomb Raider, and initially was put off from it. I went back to it again a few times, and just pushed myself through it, avoid melee and stealth kills (at least after you get the climber's axe). When I finally got through it, I really enjoyed the actual game play aspects and decided to do another play through. Though this time, I intentionally didn't learn specific skills and avoided the more gruesome melee and stealth kills. And yeah the first in game required animal kill was a good way to express her uneasiness and aversion to violence. And I think this has been brought up in this thread before by other posters; but I think the escalation to what she was willing to do as the game progressed, almost seem counter to her initial aversion to violence. Like the skills that you can learn get more brutal and gruesome, for someone that wasn't wanting to kill in the first place. But I think that speaks more to the fact that violence of a gruesome nature is what constitutes an "adult" game, which goes back to whether or not much of, at least Americans, are desensitized to violence, as developers are only putting this in their games because there is a demand for it and it sells. Also why Nintendo's consoles and games have always been considered "kiddie". Well, that's one way to make the game more challenging! I don't think having Lara do violence is a matter of making the game "adult"; I mean, people are constantly trying to kill her (and her friends). Also I see it as a reflection of her being pushed to the edge mentally and emotionally...it a survival game after all. |
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Jun 19, 2017 12:58:56 GMT -5
Well, that's one way to make the game more challenging! I don't think having Lara do violence is a matter of making the game "adult"; I mean, people are constantly trying to kill her (and her friends). Also I see it as a reflection of her being pushed to the edge mentally and emotionally...it a survival game after all. I meant more, at least in the mentality of American gamers, that something like Splatoon is kiddie because of the lack or real world or realistic violence like in Tomb Raider. I have no issue with the progression of the story as far as how she survives and reacts to those trying to kill her and her friends. More the developers feeling that unless the violence depicted in the game is gratuitous that people won't think of it as an "adult" game. Which is a large demographic as video games age and push forward in culture. And they have to feel that way for a reason, because the demand must to be there, for them to continue to produce them. Now Nintendo's family friendly take on games, even with ones with violence, like Breath of the Wild, are niche because they nerf the violence. Even though Link is still hacking and slashing his way to Ganon with various weapons. |
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Post by LovesGilKane on Jun 23, 2017 7:13:52 GMT -5
I'm more sensitised to violence, and I was already mega-anti-violence in the 1st place. the problem is that puritanically-censoring violence (ala the British 'video-nasty' debacle, blacklisting laughable violence such as the Fulci trilogy) merely leads to more emotionally profane violence, with no creative thought behind it (unlike Fulci), such as the !^#%%!!! stuff such as 'Hostel'.
not to mention some 'violence-for-the-sake-of-violence' garbage winning awards/accolades at Sundance.
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