I don't know what's going on with Thor, but they could be setting up a promotion for the Falcon so that guy can take the lead in the fourth etc Captain America film. I'd like to see Sam & T'challah team-up in Cap 4. A Shaft Goes To Africa vibe. Tarantino to write & direct.
Post by Crimebuster on Jul 17, 2014 22:40:45 GMT -5
I suspect characters are being created, but not in a way that really gives them a spotlight or the chance to become breakout characters. Part of that has to do with the incredibly fragmented market at the moment, with the big two pumping out, what, over 100 titles a month or something? Unless there's a major promotional push, with the characters featured prominently in an event or on the covers of major books, it's very easy for new characters to just fall through the cracks.
Plus, a lot of the new characters suffer from design issues. Most of the iconic superheroes have great iconic designs. A lot of new characters seem to me to be intentionally designed to be smaller, to fill smaller, specific story needs. They don't have iconic costumes, powers, or names. They're just designed to be third tier supporting characters.
For instance, look at Avengers Academy. There's a whole team of new characters, including female and minority heroes. And they have fine names, fine powers, fine costumes, all of which work in context. But do any of them seem like they have the potential to break out as major mainstream characters? Not to me, they don't.
It's possible some of those kind of characters could grow into something bigger, but over the years, Marvel and DC have both seemed to ghettoize their characters, for lack of a better word. Look at the New Mutants, for instance. When I was a kid and the series was first coming out, I thought they would eventually grow to become the next generation of major superheroes. And now? They're still appearing in New Mutants! Cannonball made it up to the big team for awhile, but really, that was about it. Or the teen Titans - okay, in the Nu52, Cyborg finally made it to the big time with the JLA. And it only took 31 years! It's like they slot these characters in at a certain level and then leave them there forever rather than trying to develop them into something more.
Take Nico from The Runaways. She struck me as a character that had bigger potential. But a decade later, there she still is. What if instead they had done something like make her Dr. Strange's apprentice? Something that developed her into a bigger player in the MU? It could have worked, but Marvel and DC don't seem to be that interested in broadening their horizons in that way. They'd rather stick with the known quantity. And until they want to change things, things won't change.
berk said:I've always disliked all She-Hulk, Ms. Marvel, Spiderwoman, etc characters, and I see this as more of the same, so it isn't something I'm ever likely to read.
You are missing out by not reading the new volume of Ms. Marvel. Kamala Khan is easily one of the most genuinely endearing characters Marvel ever created and it's a fun book.
I don't find it hard to believe that the new Ms. Marvel is a decent book or even better than that. And, much as I dislike the idea of female knock-off characters, I don't really have a strict rule about never ever reading anything they appear in. So I don't rule out ever having a look at it, but at the same time I find I just don't have a lot of interest in current Marvel and DC output. The general tone and style, at least in the previews I see, usually reminds me of grade C-level tv writing - the obvious set-ups for the same sort of pay-offs, jokes, etc that I've already seen too much of.
To go off on a not completely unrelated tangent - and apologies in advance to those who have heard this particular rant before - one of the many things that's always disappointed me about Marvel's various treatments of The Eternals post-Kirby is that no one has ever seemed to notice that Thena played the Thor role in that series to Zuras's Odin: she was the headstrong but favoured offspring who didn't always see eye to eye with her father but was still second in command to that patriarchal ruler. At the same time, she was a contrast to standard male superheroes like Thor who almost always think the best way to solve a problem was to hit somebody - and to keep on hitting them until they weren't a problem any more. But all this was and apparently is too far outside the box for Marvel writers to get their heads around.
(edit: sorry travishedgecoke - can't seem to edit your name out of that quote)
Last Edit: Jul 17, 2014 23:16:58 GMT -5 by berkley
Sun Girl is a legacy character, depending on how you interpret that term. Just from a very obscure legacy.
I was aware that there was another Sun Girl from the same company but I think it can be argued that Selah Burke wasn't really inspired by the Mary Mitchell version of the character the same way Kamala Khan was inspired by Carol Danvers to become Ms. Marvel. So I think it's at least debatable in that respect.
Jaime Reyes I would argue is a legacy character and part of the Blue Beetle mythos.
He carries the name for the purpose of copyright renewal, but he doesn't act like the Ted Kord Blue Beetle, look like the Ted Kord Blue Beetle, or possess tools and abilities in any way similar to the Ted Kord Blue Beetle. His success has been based almost entirely on the character's own merits, not the continuation of a legacy that (quite honestly) the average reader didn't care much about.
Kamala Khan is an example of the right way to introduce a new character that isn't your typical white male superhero. The creators obviously are familiar with her culture and they integrate it into the story respectfully and organically, and not in a manner that smacks of tokenism. At the same time they don't fetishize it either by constantly harping on it and making a point of it every story. I also think part of the reason why she works is because people can still relate to her even if they aren't exactly like her. As a minority/immigrant myself, even though I am neither Muslim nor Pakistani, I found a lot of familiarity in her experiences.
Post by travishedgecoke on Jul 18, 2014 0:14:09 GMT -5
I just don't feel a need to worry if someone putting on Cap's mask is just to drum up controversy, because, a) I'm not seeing the controversy, and b) it's someone who knows Cap a lot better than Bucky did. I don't care how close Bucky and Cap were seventy years ago, when Bucky/Winter Soldier took on the Cap identity they had barely known each other for decades.
Did it make for a stunt? Yeah. But, it made for a good story, too, and so could this.
When it worries me, is when the talent start giving reasons for doing a change that themselves are problematic. Azz is the king of this. His reasoning for making Ebony White a girl ('cause black girls are sassy, donchaknow), or why Black Canary is some-kinda-vague-repressed-ethnicity who wants to be white. Azz making Captain Fear a white guy who's also a giant ethnic stereotype with a dumb accent.
That stuff bugs the hell out of me. I don't mean to just pick on Azzarello, who is a talented writer, but he's just an easy go-to for stupid stupid reasons to do a race change.
Welcome to the forum kurrgomaul, and great first topic choice.
The time has never been better to introduce new, more diverse characters. The world needs them.
The revamped characters just feel like a sales gimmick. I was a bit disappointed to see Falcon with Cap's shield. They should have morphed him a bit more, like into a new character called American Eagle or something. Now that would have been interesting.
Same goes for She-Thor. Now I love the idea of having a tall, powerful female character that kicks butt, similar to Brienne of Tarth (from Game of Thrones). It's a lot of fun to root for Brienne because it's not everyday we see a woman that big and physical beating up other guys. But we all know the Mighty Thor will return again. Why not introduce a new, powerfully huge female character?
I hope Marvel at least pulls a page or two out of Roger Stern's textbook example of how to concisely craft and introduce a new superhero, as was done with the revamped version of Captain Marvel in Amazing Spider-man Annual #16. Stern did a perfect job in introducing a black, female superhero that had suddenly acquired an extraordinary power, and it was unforgettably awesome. That issue remains one of my favorite ASM's to this very day.
They're doing it as a PR stunt. Why else would they go out of their way to advertise it on The View on the Colbert Report?
News flash: They will try to get as much PR as possible out of everything they do. But in this case, they try to do it with creating more diversity, which in my book is much better than trying to do it with more rape and deaths.
Why's marvel changing ethnicity and gender its characters?