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Post by Randle-El on Jun 30, 2014 11:02:02 GMT -5
Did anyone pick up Outcast #1 by Kirkman last week? Apparently it's already sold out and scalpers are making a killing on eBay.
I had it on pre-order at my local store. Thought it was an entertaining first issue, with a solid mystery to explore. Definitely looking to pick up the series.
I was intrigued by Kirkman's comments on the back page though. He basically said that while he thinks the idea of zombies is completely unrealistic and could never happen, he believes that evidence exists of genuine demonic possession and that's why he finds the concept of Outcast to be more terrifying than The Walking Dead. Now, Kirkman has never struck me as a very spiritual or religious man (though I have read that the book was in part inspired by his Christian upbringing), but I found it interesting that he would believe that demon possession was a real thing. I always had the impression (perhaps incorrect) that Kirkman was an atheist, and my experience has been that atheists are generally not willing to accept things like demonic possession -- for the obvious reason that atheists tend to disbelievers in all things supernatural. But also because if you're going to admit that the devil exists, you should be at least open to the idea that a god exists.
Also, I noticed my local store had extra copies of Southern Bastards #1 by Jason Aaron, which I picked up on a whim. Something about it seemed derivative, but I can't quite place my finger on what story or film it might have taken some cues from -- something along the lines of hero leaves his backwater hometown due to unexplained trauma, comes back years and years later to find that unsavory elements have taken control, proceeds to clean up the town with his unique brand of justice. It sounds like the plot of some 80s action flick. Anyway, derivative though it may have been, I thought it was executed well, and look forward to picking up future issues.
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Post by thebeastofyuccaflats on Jun 30, 2014 11:46:11 GMT -5
Also, I noticed my local store had extra copies of Southern Bastards #1 by Jason Aaron, which I picked up on a whim. Something about it seemed derivative, but I can't quite place my finger on what story or film it might have taken some cues from -- something along the lines of hero leaves his backwater hometown due to unexplained trauma, comes back years and years later to find that unsavory elements have taken control, proceeds to clean up the town with his unique brand of justice. It sounds like the plot of some 80s action flick. Anyway, derivative though it may have been, I thought it was executed well, and look forward to picking up future issues. Essentially, yeah. SB is a self-admitted loveletter to rural crime and/or noir a la Walking Tall or Billy Jack. I thought Aaron did very well, but of the Two Jasons, Latour is the one who's *really* blown my hair back thus far. |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jun 30, 2014 13:09:24 GMT -5
I haven't read SB yet, it's in the pile though. Read mostly the Marvel stuff (and Fables.. Fables is always first) so far... nothing particularly thrilling. I'm not sure I like angry Black Cat in ASM... it makes sense, but I don't like it. It's really interesting to start seeing corporate stuff in a Spidey comic... makes me wonder if Slott could do Iron Man, actually.
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Post by Jasoomian on Jun 30, 2014 13:13:55 GMT -5
What "corporate stuff"?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 13:25:03 GMT -5
And you would be surprised how many writers who may be good technically (story structure, grammar, good ear for dialogue, etc.) have zero originality or ability to come up with plots and ideas that are not hackeneyed or cliched, and how many people who have ideas lack the technical skills and basic grasp of story structure to turn the idea into a story or to write a coherent comprehensible sentence. When I was starting out writing inthe rgp field, I had an editor take me aside on the con floor and tell me basically ideas are worthless. The have no value. Look at this floor. Just about everyone one of them is full of ideas for stories and games. So much so, they are willing to give them away for free if you give them 2 minutes to listen to them. It's all worthless. I can't sell ideas. I sell finished products so I need writers who can produce competent manuscripts who can execute ideas, whether their own or someone else's. Without that manuscript, we have no story, no product and no revenue. Don't come to me with ideas, come to me with manuscripts. A lot of people have ideas and want to have written, very few have what it takes to write or are willing to put the time and effort in to write and write well. Ideas are easy. Writing is hard. You need to decide if you want to be a writer or just another dude with ideas wandering around a con floor..then I showed him the textbook on writing or incoming college freshman I had done and a copy of the 75K word manuscript I had done for another publisher and he gave me an assignment.... -M Well put. How many athletes get by on their talent or sheer athleticism, but don't put in the day-in/day-out practice to really shine? Or vice versa -- how many with lesser talents are able to succeed because they are persistent and put in the hard work or get the right training? What you just wrote there could also be generalized to apply more broadly to any field where the right balance of talent vs. training/nurture/practice is necessary to produce good results -- art, music, sports, writing. I guess that depends on if you think the overbearing corporate policy of strict editorial mandates interfering with every aspect of storytelling being a good thing or not. I don't think it improves stories. In fact, I don't even think a good story is their main goal. Sure, it's one of their goals, somewhere on the list, maybe below five or so other goals that include shipping on time, crossing over with other crap, all the women being fanservice props, and involving Wolverine somehow. So they hope it's a good story, but if not they're not redoing it, it has to go to print, and at least they found a way to shove Wolverine in there. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 30, 2014 19:53:18 GMT -5
I guess that depends on if you think the overbearing corporate policy of strict editorial mandates interfering with every aspect of storytelling being a good thing or not. I don't think it improves stories. In fact, I don't even think a good story is their main goal. Sure, it's one of their goals, somewhere on the list, maybe below five or so other goals that include shipping on time, crossing over with other crap, all the women being fanservice props, and involving Wolverine somehow. So they hope it's a good story, but if not they're not redoing it, it has to go to print, and at least they found a way to shove Wolverine in there. For the past few years I've had the impression that the overwhelming directive has been to have comics act as extensions for films and cartoons. Hence old continuity being sidetracked so that characters are now treated like their movie counterparts, sometimes with no acknowledgement that the "real" version ever existed. |
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Post by hondobrode on Jun 30, 2014 20:03:36 GMT -5
Outcast sounds great. Someone else is doing something similar, like Devilers at Boom maybe ?
The aforementioned reasons are part of why I buy Marvel out of continuity projects (rare) and the Ultimate line.
Yes, Southern Bastards sounds like Walking Tall to me, but that's a good thing.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jul 1, 2014 7:51:47 GMT -5
Thanks to Dr. Octopus... there is now a 'Parker Industries'. It was initially more or less a front for Superior Spidey to make his Spider-gadgets in public, but when Peter took his body back, he declared he was no longer associated with Spidey... he's now trying to focus on getting a contract to build a new superpowered prison.(which doesn't make much sense, I know, but I'm going with it) There's also a side story where some sort of project Otto was working on is being pick up by Otto's girlfriend, to help cover the fact that Peter can't really finish it, even though it's 'his' thing. It feels like the company is going to be a focus of the book to me, but I guess time will tell. |
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Post by Randle-El on Jul 1, 2014 10:39:56 GMT -5
Thanks to Dr. Octopus... there is now a 'Parker Industries'. It was initially more or less a front for Superior Spidey to make his Spider-gadgets in public, but when Peter took his body back, he declared he was no longer associated with Spidey... he's now trying to focus on getting a contract to build a new superpowered prison.(which doesn't make much sense, I know, but I'm going with it) There's also a side story where some sort of project Otto was working on is being pick up by Otto's girlfriend, to help cover the fact that Peter can't really finish it, even though it's 'his' thing. It feels like the company is going to be a focus of the book to me, but I guess time will tell. One thing I appreciate about Dan Slott's run is that he reminded us that Peter Parker is the scientific genius who invented his own web fluid and web shooters. Why should he have to struggle by peddling photos to the Bugle when he can easily get a job doing scientific research? It makes much more sense. However, I do think that Slott took that idea and ran with it a bit too far. Having him work a science job as an employee of someone else (when he was at Horizon Labs) still gives the book an opportunity to show Peter as not being in control while in his civilian life and having to take orders or abuse from his superior. But making him a CEO with underlings of his own feels a little out of place in a Spider-Man book. |
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jul 1, 2014 11:53:37 GMT -5
I think you could be right... the jury's still out, though. He does have a co-head/CFO/partner that rides him pretty hard for not being around enough (due to Spidey-stuff)... that could work, if done right. I agree with you the Horizon thing was perfect... I think there was more to do with that Status quo before they blew it up, but C'est la vie.
It definitely has worked so far, IMO, but it is a big change.
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ironchimp
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Post by ironchimp on Jul 1, 2014 14:39:13 GMT -5
Well put. How many athletes get by on their talent or sheer athleticism, but don't put in the day-in/day-out practice to really shine? Or vice versa -- how many with lesser talents are able to succeed because they are persistent and put in the hard work or get the right training? What you just wrote there could also be generalized to apply more broadly to any field where the right balance of talent vs. training/nurture/practice is necessary to produce good results -- art, music, sports, writing. marvel and Dc have topline writers though - they all come with a good body of imaginative indie work or leave and write some top genre work. why would i want to read some editor who hasnt written a book in his life tell them what to write. it would be like me saying "just bunt this one" to babe ruth. people were paying to see babe ruth smack it out the park not have a stroll to first base (he said with vague baseball analogy he doesnt understand) |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jul 1, 2014 14:54:02 GMT -5
I just took a peek at the Guardians of the galaxy/All new X-Men crossover, and I am immensely impressed by Sarah Pichelli's artwork. And believe me, as a fan of the DnA guardians, I was fully prepared to hate everything about this new iteration of the team.
She's brilliant with facial expressions, and for once women, albeit often well-endowed, look like human beings (even when, y'know, green).
Designs and page layouts are also pretty cool. I think I've just found my favourite new artist for this year.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2014 15:07:12 GMT -5
Well put. How many athletes get by on their talent or sheer athleticism, but don't put in the day-in/day-out practice to really shine? Or vice versa -- how many with lesser talents are able to succeed because they are persistent and put in the hard work or get the right training? What you just wrote there could also be generalized to apply more broadly to any field where the right balance of talent vs. training/nurture/practice is necessary to produce good results -- art, music, sports, writing. marvel and Dc have topline writers though - they all come with a good body of imaginative indie work or leave and write some top genre work. why would i want to read some editor who hasnt written a book in his life tell them what to write. it would be like me saying "just bunt this one" to babe ruth. people were paying to see babe ruth smack it out the park not have a stroll to first base (he said with vague baseball analogy he doesnt understand) Because for the vast majority of comic readers they are coming to read thecharacters not the talent, so they want to read an Avengers story that they can realte to not Hickman out there version of the team in many cases, because they care about the Avengers, not about Hickman (or Bendis, or Remender, or Stan Lee, or whoever), so the talent is secondary to the characters for them. And more people came to see the Yankees win than Ruth smack it out of the ballpark, and if he bunted and they won they would be happier than if he hit a home run and they lost. Not saying it is right, but that is the view a lot of people take. Anecdote form our shop-Marvel or DC changes creative team-customers don't bat an eye-change the characters costume or status quo and it's what re they doing to MY character, I will drop the book if they do that... and yes this is different than other creative storytelling media (except maybe movies and television) with books and such its ore about the creator, but that's not how comics work for the masses. People flock to editorial driven comics for the same reasons they flock to Michael Bay movies-the spectacle and big booms with action heroes. -M |
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ironchimp
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Post by ironchimp on Jul 1, 2014 16:19:03 GMT -5
yeah thats a fair point - there is a definite split between readers who follow creators and readers who follow characters and for a good proportion of readers its the editors job to make sure characters behave in "character" and preserve the "legacy" of the character. I do get the impression though these days that its more a 50-50 split between those two groups. FF basically lost half of its readership after hickman left, action lost a a huge chunk after morrison left etc. Personally i'll read any old character if the team is to my taste but yeah... thats not quite how comics work and it's impossible to argue that people do just love editorial driven events.
thats why i'm enjoying the little of marvel now i've read tho - it seems they've let writers and artists off the leash for "small" books and "big" books have all the editorial fireworks - so there is something for everyone.
(i knew my baseball analogy would be terrible!)
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Post by Dizzy D on Jul 1, 2014 16:45:25 GMT -5
I just took a peek at the Guardians of the galaxy/All new X-Men crossover, and I am immensely impressed by Sarah Pichelli's artwork. And believe me, as a fan of the DnA guardians, I was fully prepared to hate everything about this new iteration of the team. She's brilliant with facial expressions, and for once women, albeit often well-endowed, look like human beings (even when, y'know, green). Designs and page layouts are also pretty cool. I think I've just found my favourite new artist for this year. She has been pretty great on Ultimate Spider-Man as well. |
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