shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Nov 5, 2014 20:34:21 GMT -5
Absolutely no one involved with the creating of the early Batman stories agrees that Kane created all of the rogues gallery. No one but Kane even believes he was responsible for The Joker, let alone the multitude of villains who came around in the '50s and '60s when Kane was barely even involved anymore.
There's a lot of evidence to back these assertions, especially the testimony of Jerry Robinson, who has less reason to lie than Kane did, as far as I can tell.
Kane taking credit for everything made sense for the time period. Prior to the rise of Marvel, there was no culture of properly crediting writers and artists. Kane made the deal that got Batman started, and he subcontracted out Finger, Robinson, and virtually everyone else in the early days, attaching his name to their work. They knew the deal and agreed to it.
But, when the culture changed, Kane clung to his story, and that's when he became a liar. Of course, after Bill Finger's death, he came clean about a number of things, but all you need do is look up Kane interviews where he explains how he came up with the idea for Batman, and even there he contradicts himself left and right. He's a habitual liar who can't even keep his stories straight.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2014 21:09:10 GMT -5
But, when the culture changed, Kane clung to his story, and that's when he became a liar. Of course, after Bill Finger's death, he came clean about a number of things, but all you need do is look up Kane interviews where he explains how he came up with the idea for Batman, and even there he contradicts himself left and right. He's a habitual liar who can't even keep his stories straight. claimed that David Wood created Mr. Freeze and I'm having a hard time accepting it - however he did made an argument against Bob Kane. However, I was told by Mr. Kane back in early 70's that he was responsible for creating Mr. Freeze and had contractual obligation towards that character. However, Ish claimed that he doesn't while Slam Bradley of which I was going to write in contractually obligated and I did not want to write that in my first response to Ish Kabbible because it will turn him off in a big way. Now, you shaxper is calling Bob Kane a habitable liar and couldn't keep his stories straight bothers me and I have to respect your point here because you are quite knowledgeable in the world of Comics and it will bothers me even more because I thought Bob Kane was telling the truth back in early 70's. Right Now - I'm torn apart by both Slam Bradley and your comments here and that's alone makes me think twice about things. If I offended anyone here that I claimed that Bob Kane created Mr. Freeze - I'm sorry that I said that and because of that - I've changed the Creator Name to both Bob Kane and David Wood. Sorry Everyone ... |
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Nov 5, 2014 21:37:16 GMT -5
But, when the culture changed, Kane clung to his story, and that's when he became a liar. Of course, after Bill Finger's death, he came clean about a number of things, but all you need do is look up Kane interviews where he explains how he came up with the idea for Batman, and even there he contradicts himself left and right. He's a habitual liar who can't even keep his stories straight. claimed that David Wood created Mr. Freeze and I'm having a hard time accepting it - however he did made an argument against Bob Kane. However, I was told by Mr. Kane back in early 70's that he was responsible for creating Mr. Freeze and had contractual obligation towards that character. However, Ish claimed that he doesn't while Slam Bradley of which I was going to write in contractually obligated and I did not want to write that in my first response to Ish Kabbible because it will turn him off in a big way. Now, you shaxper is calling Bob Kane a habitable liar and couldn't keep his stories straight bothers me and I have to respect your point here because you are quite knowledgeable in the world of Comics and it will bothers me even more because I thought Bob Kane was telling the truth back in early 70's. Right Now - I'm torn apart by both Slam Bradley and your comments here and that's alone makes me think twice about things. If I offended anyone here that I claimed that Bob Kane created Mr. Freeze - I'm sorry that I said that and because of that - I've changed the Creator Name to both Bob Kane and David Wood. Sorry Everyone ... When it comes to comic books, no one should take things personally. "It's just lines on paper,folks" has been said many times in the past and is oh so true. And welcome to the legion of people who Bob Kane, er, embelished quite a bit on his contributions to the Batman history. I recall going to the 1970 NYC Comic Convention and seeing Bob Kane deliver a seminar of Batman to the audience. He took credit for everything and I mean everything relating to Batman up till that time. Bill Finger,Shelly Moldoff,Dick Sprang,Ed Herron,Jerry Robinson,Dave Wood-not a word mentioned of the people who actually did the work. Kane held on to this version all through the Batman TV show craze and only began to relent towards the end of his life and after Bill Finger was dead and buried. I give Bob Kane credit for his contributions, however limited, to Batman in the early years. I also give him props for playing hardball with DC and successfully being able to retain some of his rights as a creator. That was certainly not an easy thing to accomplish back in the day. But he was a liar regarding who did the actual writing and art. An out-and-out liar for decades to the folks at DC,the press,the fans,to the point were nothing he ever said can be taken as truth |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Nov 5, 2014 21:56:40 GMT -5
Life is too short to get upset by funnybooks.
Bob Kane's relationship with DC was almost unique in comics. He had a close relative who was an attorney. They asserted that Kane was a minor when he signed Batman over to National Periodicals. If that had been the case the contract was voidable. So Kane renegotiated the contract to provide Kane a yearly payment in addition to being given a yearly number of pages to be "produced" by him. And his byline would appear on those stories.
It's very clear that Kane was very uninvolved in the actual production of the comics that bore his byline as early as the early 40s.
Now I have zero idea who did what in the creation of Mr. Zero. And I'm not terribly concerned about it. But the story would have Kane's name on it even if he had zero input in the story.
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Post by Hoosier X on Nov 5, 2014 22:03:49 GMT -5
I once saw Jerry Robinson, Lew Sayre Schwarz and Sheldon Moldoff on a panel at the San Diego Comic-Con (2009, I think) and it was an awful lot of stories about what a jerk Bob Kane was. Moldoff said: "He was the most miserable bastard I ever knew in my life."
Robinson and Schwarz said the same thing in less colorful language.
But Moldoff was very bitter but very funny. One story he told was that Bob Kane would hop out of a cab a block from the destination and say he had an appointment and he would meet the other guys later. That way, he got out of paying his part of the taxi fare. One time he did it in traffic and another car knocked the door off the cab! Kane was lucky he wasn't hurt, but he took off anyway and left his buddies to deal with the cab driver!
That panel was the most fun I ever had at a comic book convention.
We should provide a few links for JLA SilveAgeFan so he can some of the info on the real Bob Kane.
Was it Steranko that was going to punch him?
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shaxper
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Posts: 22,330
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Post by shaxper on Nov 5, 2014 22:05:20 GMT -5
No need to worry about offending anyone, JLA SilverAgeFan.
And I completely agree with Slam-Bradley's explanation above. Kane got credit for it because he had a legal arrangement with DC to get credit for every Batman story produced. That he then told you to your face he created the character was an outright lie, and one that was consistent with his character.
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Post by Hoosier X on Nov 5, 2014 22:11:28 GMT -5
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Post by Hoosier X on Nov 5, 2014 22:15:44 GMT -5
Full disclosure: I'm a bit partial to Bill Finger. Over at Brian Cronin's "Comics Should Be Good," they're having a reader's poll about the Top Ten Comic Book Artists and Top Ten Comic Book Writers, and I put Bill Finger in at #2, behind Alan Moore.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,330
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Post by shaxper on Nov 5, 2014 22:20:02 GMT -5
MUST reading for any comic book fan. The vast body of evidence suggests that we have Finger to thank more than any other one person for the character we now know as Batman. Kane sold National on the name. Finger designed the costume, the alter ego, and possibly even the back story (or was that Robinson?) as well as wrote the actual stories. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2014 23:15:47 GMT -5
The Steranko meets Kane story is one of my favorite comic anecdotes ever! I've probably read it twenty to thirty times now and I am entertained thoroughly every time I do. But then I am a huge Steranko fan!
-M
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2014 5:47:52 GMT -5
Dear Everyone,
I never, really knew the other side of Bob Kane and after reading all the posts here and the links that was provided by Hoosier X and I finally understand the whole picture now. It's been very enlightening to learn all this. So, thanks for your contribution and all ...
JLA SilverAgeFan.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2014 5:49:56 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2014 5:56:32 GMT -5
GOOD NEWS EVERYONE
I got my 50 Comic Book Ladies all done and uploaded to my Photobucket Account and I will be sharing 100 pictures and it will be more a pictorial countdown with lots of personal understanding of each of the character listed here; and I think you all will be very entertained by this countdown.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,330
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Post by shaxper on Nov 6, 2014 7:50:44 GMT -5
Dear Everyone, I never, really knew the other side of Bob Kane and after reading all the posts here and the links that was provided by Hoosier X and I finally understand the whole picture now. It's been very enlightening to learn all this. So, thanks for your contribution and all ... JLA SilverAgeFan. Of course, there's always more than one side to a story, JLA SilverAgeFan. Should you decide to do further digging and come back, refuting our points in defense of Bob Kane, that would be very welcome conversation. We're all of the same opinion, and there's evidence to support that opinion, but that doesn't make it an irrefutable fact. There ARE Kane defenders out there with (some) evidence to lean on. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2014 14:21:39 GMT -5
Number 35 - Dr. Light Alter Ego - Arthur Light Group Affiliation - The Society, Fearsome Five, Suicide Squad Injustice Gang, Injustice League Created by - Gardner Fox Illustrated by - Mike Sekowsky Abilities Genius-level intellect, Light manipulation Interesting Fact - Originally, Doctor Light derived his powers from his suit, but over time he internalized this ability, and could use his powers without having to use his costume Reason for Rank: One of my favorite JLA villain of all times; but unfortunately I did not read much about him after this adventure below and sad to say that this one was the only one that I read so far. Very crafty and planned out his attacks very methodically. 
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