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Post by codystarbuck on Feb 26, 2019 1:05:51 GMT -5
It's dopey that Marvel and DC still refuse to do anymore Crossovers. This doesn't' seem to be a problem with other companies. Even DC is crossing over with the makers of TMNT. Is it a corporate decision as to not "help" the competitors Movie Franchises? With the other companies, DC/Warner is the 800 lb gorilla; they dictate terms and the others take them or leave them. With Disney, there is another 800 lb gorilla and they have to fight for dominance. Previous Marvel owners weren't that big and the editorial regimes were at least colleagues who could work out the politics, until Shooter and JLA/Avengers, where it almost seemed like either a personal grudge against Conway or just a power play by Shooter. That killed things until the 90s, when there was a more amiable editorial regime and a pretty shaky market, where cooperation looked like it might actually benefit both, financially. It didn't hurt that the central figures were Mark Gruenwald and Mike Carlin, as Carlin had been Gruenwald's assistant.
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Post by tarkintino on Feb 26, 2019 6:16:30 GMT -5
Yeah, I didn't get the fuss over the Fleisher cartoons either. The "fuss" is that they captured Superman--from his personality to general appearance, Lois' relationship to Clark & his other half in a way closer than almost any other adaptation--including live action, with the Donner '78 version being the exception. Until the WB/"Timmverse" cartoons (and Grantray-Lawrence's 1966 Marvel Super Heroes for story) it stood alone in its category. The majority of everything else was trash (1980s/90s Marvel cartoons), misguided (e.g. every Spider-Man cartoon produced in this century, especially the "mole-Parker" version).
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Post by Mormel on Feb 26, 2019 7:11:47 GMT -5
I'm sorry, "mole-Parker"?
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Post by tarkintino on Feb 26, 2019 14:28:01 GMT -5
I'm sorry, "mole-Parker"? In The Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon (2008-09), the producers decided to add a mole to Parker's upper left cheek. My only guess is that they thought that would make him relatable or "flawed"...as if he was not in every version covering his high school years produced up to that time....
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Post by Duragizer on Feb 27, 2019 2:29:34 GMT -5
- Crisis on Infinite Earths should've ended with issue 10.
- The post-Crisis Superman should've been an amalgamated Earth-2/Earth-1 Superman (more of the former than the latter) who made his debut in 1938, had a cousin, Kara, who made her debut as Supergirl in 1959, etc.
- Marv Wolfman should've spearheaded the Superman relaunch, with John Byrne serving as penciller and co-plotter.
- The post-Crisis Brainiac should've been the robotic skeletal Brainiac designed by Ed Hannigan.
- Zero Hour should've been used to reinstate the DC Multiverse, with the post-Crisis Earth rechristened Earth-0.
- The post-Crisis/post-Zero Hour DC Universe should've operated under real time.
- Birthright, Identity Crisis, Infinite Crisis, 52, Final Crisis, Flashpoint, etc. should've never, ever happened.
There, I said it (all).
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Post by Icctrombone on Feb 27, 2019 7:15:56 GMT -5
- Crisis on Infinite Earths should've ended with issue 10.
- The post-Crisis Superman should've been an amalgamated Earth-2/Earth-1 Superman (more of the former than the latter) who made his debut in 1938, had a cousin, Kara, who made her debut as Supergirl in 1959, etc.
- Marv Wolfman should've spearheaded the Superman relaunch, with John Byrne serving as penciller and co-plotter.
- The post-Crisis Brainiac should've been the robotic skeletal Brainiac designed by Ed Hannigan.
- Zero Hour should've been used to reinstate the DC Multiverse, with the post-Crisis Earth rechristened Earth-0.
- The post-Crisis/post-Zero Hour DC Universe should've operated under real time.
- Birthright, Identity Crisis, Infinite Crisis, 52, Final Crisis, Flashpoint, etc. should've never, ever happened.
There, I said it (all). I agree with all but the bolded comments. 12 issues worked fine , unless you mean it was happier ending after # 10. Marv Wolfman wrote the Adventures title and was designing the post Crisis Superman along with Byrne. I thought Byrne did a nice job overall.
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Post by kirby101 on Feb 27, 2019 8:56:10 GMT -5
When the Superman titles got to the triangle years with all the books inter-related week to week, overseen by Mike Carlin, I thought they were about the best Superhero books being published at that time. Certainly the most enjoyable for me.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Feb 27, 2019 11:19:57 GMT -5
- Crisis on Infinite Earths should've ended with issue 10.
- Birthright, Identity Crisis, Infinite Crisis, 52, Final Crisis, Flashpoint, etc. should've never, ever happened.
There, I said it (all). Crisis should have been killed before it ever happened and then we wouldn't have had to have a zillion attempts to fix and refine the mess it made. There, I said it.
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Post by Icctrombone on Feb 27, 2019 11:24:44 GMT -5
I liked the event, but didn't like the aftermath.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Feb 27, 2019 11:27:30 GMT -5
I liked the event, but didn't like the aftermath. I liked it when I was 17. Reading it later it became clear it was a nonsensical story that "fixed" a problem that didn't actually exist with a whole mess of other actual problems.
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Post by Icctrombone on Feb 27, 2019 11:29:42 GMT -5
The only part that became nonsensical was when they placed time travel and different eras into the mix. Involving the past and the future turned it goofy.
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Post by MDG on Feb 27, 2019 11:48:27 GMT -5
I liked the event, but didn't like the aftermath. I liked it when I was 17. Reading it later it became clear it was a nonsensical story that "fixed" a problem that didn't actually exist with a whole mess of other actual problems. Agree--When Fox and Schwartz came up with Earth-2, they were able to explain how the JSA, etc., could exist as well as the Silver Age heroes. Explain, not fix. That that same explanation could also be used for the Quality and Fawcett characters was icing on the cake. Kept the heritage, but didn't get in the way of new developments.
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Post by Icctrombone on Feb 27, 2019 13:21:03 GMT -5
I never liked the Venom character and I think his appearance and overexposure has hurt the Spider-man Franchise.
There I said it.
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Post by brutalis on Feb 27, 2019 13:32:35 GMT -5
I never liked the Venom character and I think his appearance and overexposure has hurt the Spider-man Franchise. There I said it. I agree about the over exposure. In the beginning it was a unique idea of a symbiotic relationship 'tween Peter Parker and the "suit" itself. But once taking on the whole Venom personality and there being an entire evil race of them out there, it just started to become less entertaining and more bleh. But the fans must disagree since Venom continues with series after series and the movie made big bucks.
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Post by tarkintino on Feb 27, 2019 13:57:37 GMT -5
- Crisis on Infinite Earths should've ended with issue 10.
- Birthright, Identity Crisis, Infinite Crisis, 52, Final Crisis, Flashpoint, etc. should've never, ever happened.
There, I said it (all). Crisis should have been killed before it ever happened and then we wouldn't have had to have a zillion attempts to fix and refine the mess it made. There, I said it. It did not create a mess. If certain writers and the fanbase simply accepted the changes instead of trying to undo them, DC's main lines would have moved forward as it was meant to. No fixing required. Crisis on Infinite Earths was one of the best things to ever happen to DC and comics in general in being the first to give a fluid, event/drama movie-like feel to a comic, and no one has come close to its majestic feel since, with the possible exception of Kingdom Come.
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