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Post by lordyam on Dec 24, 2023 17:44:17 GMT -5
I like the OT pretty well; the prequels not so much but I get what Lucas was trying to do with them even if the execution didn't always land. I've noticed that others have reevaluated (and even those who still hate them have acknowledged that going after Ahmed Best and Jake Lloyd was wrong). Return of the Jedi is in some ways the best AND worst; Luke's scenes with Vader are great, and I honestly feel that if they had cut the "certain point of view" nonsense AND showed that Vader had been badly unsettled by cloud city it would have been great. The sequels were just a mess. TFA was basically just ANH, TLJ.......I truly get what Jonson wanted to do but I feel that he ignored established things to pull it off (let me put it this way. Luke only lashed out at Vader when things were truly dire for everyone; the vision of Kylo wasn't dire enough, and he would have learned SOME control. While I see the thought crossing his mind I don't see him actually drawing his weapon). Holdo also came off as rather inept (Poe's actual question, do you have a plan, was quite reasonable given the circumstances, and yet she gives vague platitudes at best. There's no reason to believe there's a spy and she later implies she likes him, which just makes it seem dumber.) TROS.....I went to a BJ's right afterwards. The meal was tepid and mediocre, just like the movie. That said, Harrison Ford's seen with Kylo WAS very well done and I think Palpatine could have worked if they built him up properly (the TOR MMO expansion echos of oblivion basically had the big bad perish in a way that was similar....but it was MUCH better handled). Edit: A fanfic writer HandOfThrawn45 did their own stories to wrap up the EU, while also righting some of the more mean spirited elements that plagued the later stories. Some of the story elements are a little out there but it DOES do a good job fixing the mean spirited grimderp, and Legacy's End feels like a PERFECT swan song to both the Skywalkers and the Star Wars saga. archiveofourown.org/users/HandofThrawn45/pseuds/HandofThrawn45
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Post by Jesse on Dec 30, 2023 23:09:31 GMT -5
Fan made animation depicting Anakin and Obi Wan fighting in Revenge of the Sith but done in the style of Clone Wars.
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Post by sunofdarkchild on Dec 31, 2023 9:48:30 GMT -5
It just goes to show how incredible Hayden and Ewan are at lightsaber fighting - outside of the Kenobi series - that even a well-done animation is slower than they were in real life.
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Post by Calidore on Dec 31, 2023 14:03:37 GMT -5
It just goes to show how incredible Hayden and Ewan are at lightsaber fighting - outside of the Kenobi series - that even a well-done animation is slower than they were in real life. I remember Liam Neeson saying he envied Ewan's ability to remember a dozen moves, while Liam could only do four or five.
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Post by lordyam on Jan 2, 2024 15:49:29 GMT -5
One thing I’ve noticed; even people who hate Jar Jar have come to accept that the attacks Ahmed Best were needlessly cruel. It helps he got a better part in the Mandalorian.
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Post by GoldenAge Heroes! on Feb 3, 2024 14:30:39 GMT -5
One thing I’ve noticed; even people who hate Jar Jar have come to accept that the attacks Ahmed Best were needlessly cruel. It helps he got a better part in the Mandalorian. Yeah, it was over the top stuff that he got back in the day. Thankfully he pushed through it and he's still here with us and doing well. I'm thrilled that he's still in the bizz and working with Lucasfilm - Star Wars again, even though i'm no modern Disney fan to say the least. Although, I'm one of those weird fans that actually like Jar Jar Binks. Never minded those fun sidekick kinda characters I grew up with as long as they weren't too-too much and overshadowed the heroes. George actually cut a considerable amount of Jar jar out of the film according to the script version that I read a long time ago.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Feb 7, 2024 14:57:06 GMT -5
One thing I’ve noticed; even people who hate Jar Jar have come to accept that the attacks Ahmed Best were needlessly cruel. It helps he got a better part in the Mandalorian. Yeah, it was over the top stuff that he got back in the day. Thankfully he pushed through it and he's still here with us and doing well. I'm thrilled that he's still bizz and working with Lucasfilm - Star Wars again, even though i'm no modern Disney fan to say the least. Although, I'm one of those weird fans that actually like Jar Jar Binks. Never minded those fun sidekick kinda characters I grew up with as long as they weren't too-too much and overshadowed the heroes. George actually cut a considerable amount of Jar jar out of the film according to the script version that I read a long time ago. I liked Jar Jar and the Gungans. I could have done without the potty jokes but those folks were brave, resourceful and selfless.
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Post by impulse on Feb 7, 2024 17:28:29 GMT -5
There really is a nasty, toxic underbelly to fandom in general. Tangent, but there's a lot of hostility and venom being spewed about Netflix's upcoming Avatar: The Last Airbender. As part of the ramp-up marketing push, they are doing some interviews and such where the creators are pointing out some (relatively minor, IMO) changes to character arcs and such, and people are losing. Their. Minds. It's just ridiculous, and it casts an ugly shadow on fandom in general.
Ahmed Best and Jake Lloyd should have never gotten the venom they did. They were characters in a fantasy movie for Pete's sake. One of them was just a kid, and the movies weren't even that bad.
On Star Wars in general, I'm going to paraphrase something I recently read. The OT was mostly great at what it was. The PT had shoddy execution, but the underlying story was good enough people were able to overlook it. The sequel trilogy was just a disjointed chaotic pile of crap from the outset.
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Post by lordyam on Mar 27, 2024 13:53:25 GMT -5
Yeah, it was over the top stuff that he got back in the day. Thankfully he pushed through it and he's still here with us and doing well. I'm thrilled that he's still bizz and working with Lucasfilm - Star Wars again, even though i'm no modern Disney fan to say the least. Although, I'm one of those weird fans that actually like Jar Jar Binks. Never minded those fun sidekick kinda characters I grew up with as long as they weren't too-too much and overshadowed the heroes. George actually cut a considerable amount of Jar jar out of the film according to the script version that I read a long time ago. I liked Jar Jar and the Gungans. I could have done without the potty jokes but those folks were brave, resourceful and selfless. Part of the issue is he was interpreted as a racial stereotype. They talked about it in a podcast; George Lucas based him on Goofy. Thing is, Goofy was himself based on minstrel shows so that bled in regardless of intent. The wacky antics (despite being Best's inventions) also unwittingly fueled that. One intellectual on the podcast summed it up as "the intention was good, but the ingredients had baggage and those carried over despite their intent." Today though even people who hate the character admit that attacking Best went way too far. Gives me hope for the fandom. Notably Simon Pegg regretted a rant he made on the show Spaced because it was overly mean to the actor. We need more of that.
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Post by berkley on Mar 27, 2024 18:12:24 GMT -5
I was one of those who didn't like the jar Jar character and I still don't. But I never thought the actor deserved any criticism, just the people who came up with the character concept - which I assumed was mainly Lucas. I'm not sure I even knew the actor's name until now as it doesn't ring a bell. For me the racist stereotyping wasn't the main problem - I had no trouble believing that it was inadvertent, though of course that doesn't excuse it completely.
But for me it was more the "goofiness" of the character in general - much as it was a problem for me with the Disney version of Tars Tarkas in the John Carter movie. The fact that it was deliberately based on the cartoon character - which I'm learning here for the first time - only confirms my feeling that it was a conceptual problem from the start: just a bad idea for this kind of science-fantasy adventure, which should stick to more suitable sources of inspiration (Flash Gordon, adventure serials, etc).
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 9,560
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Post by Confessor on Mar 27, 2024 20:21:10 GMT -5
For me the racist stereotyping wasn't the main problem - I had no trouble believing that it was inadvertent, though of course that doesn't excuse it completely. It wasn't just Jar Jar Binks that was a potentially offensive racial caricature though. Apart from the other Gungans, who were equally Caribbean/African-American stereotypes, there was also Watto, who was a blatantly anti-Semitic Jewish caricature, and the Neimodians, who were all crafty, "yellow peril" Japanese types. It was like George Lucas was wondering, "I wonder how many racially offensive stereotypes I can cram into this movie?" To be honest, it's a wonder that Disney haven't stuck a content warning onto the beginning of the film on their streaming service.
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Post by berkley on Mar 27, 2024 23:09:21 GMT -5
For me the racist stereotyping wasn't the main problem - I had no trouble believing that it was inadvertent, though of course that doesn't excuse it completely. It wasn't just Jar Jar Binks that was a potentially offensive racial caricature though. Apart from the other Gungans, who were equally Caribbean/African-American stereotypes, there was also Watto, who was a blatantly anti-Semitic Jewish caricature, and the Neimodians, who were all crafty, "yellow peril" Japanese types. It was like George Lucas was wondering, "I wonder how many racially offensive stereotypes I can cram into this movie?" To be honest, it's a wonder that Disney haven't stuck a content warning onto the beginning of the film on their streaming service.
I'm sure you're right but it's been so long since I've seen it I can't remember many details. Perhaps Jar Jar stood out because he was a single character and had a few lines to himself? I'll keep an eye out for those other examples if I ever see it again - which probably won't be any time in the near future: I don't detest the prequels so much that I'd refuse to watch them again but apart from re-experiencing some of the impressive visual sequences I don't feel there's much incentive for me personally.
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Post by impulse on Mar 28, 2024 8:34:24 GMT -5
Quick story time, then the point.
I got pretty into the then EU/now Legends Star Wars novels in the 90s. Off the top of my head, I read some of the ones where Luke rebuilt the Jedi academy, one of the immediately post-ROTS set ones, a handful of others. The Suncrusher rings a bell. I really enjoyed them, but largely fell off as I got more into music and girls in high school. For no good reason, I never got around to reading the original Thrawn/Heir to the Empire series. I know it was very well-regarded, but never got to it. I didn't like the cover either, which didn't help, but we know what they say about books and covers.
Anyway, fast forward to now. I listen to music while I work, but I prefer stories when I clean or do chores. I was between podcasts/audiobooks etc and decided to browse Spotify's newish Audibook collection since they now include a set amount free streaming with Premium membership. I stumbled on a newish production of the first Thrawn novel, Heir to the Empire, and figured "Oh, I used to really like this, and I like the OT era vibe more than the new stuff, so what the heck, let's give it a try."
. . .
Y'all. I'm floored. It's SO GOOD. I can't believe it took me so long, but I am glad I found it. The new production is PHENOMENAL. It's got the full licensed production with sound effects, the music, etc, and the reader is an incredibly talented voice actor who does striking impressions of the cast. Well, the men anyway. It's almost like one of these fully voice acted productions with a single actor.
I was transported back to my youth, and it was like it picked up right right where original Star Wars left off. It felt like Star Wars. It was familiar and comfortable and RIGHT. It was almost like getting a new movie in the original Star Wars movie series, like they kept going without any of the trappings of the prequels or sequels.
I'm sure this is old news to many SW fans, but anyone who hasn't read it or wants to revisit, I cannot recommend it enough. This particular production. I've already mainline the rest of the trilogy and looked up the remaining SW novels set in old EU continuity by Zahn as well as the the best and most essential to the plot.
Consider me fully reinvested in the old EU. Legends feels more like Star Wars to me than anything that's come from Lucas or Disney in decades, and I saw the fan link above about closure for this continuity. I think I have some content for a while!
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 9,560
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Post by Confessor on Mar 29, 2024 2:35:47 GMT -5
Quick story time, then the point. I got pretty into the then EU/now Legends Star Wars novels in the 90s. Off the top of my head, I read some of the ones where Luke rebuilt the Jedi academy, one of the immediately post-ROTS set ones, a handful of others. The Suncrusher rings a bell. I really enjoyed them, but largely fell off as I got more into music and girls in high school. For no good reason, I never got around to reading the original Thrawn/Heir to the Empire series. I know it was very well-regarded, but never got to it. I didn't like the cover either, which didn't help, but we know what they say about books and covers. Anyway, fast forward to now. I listen to music while I work, but I prefer stories when I clean or do chores. I was between podcasts/audiobooks etc and decided to browse Spotify's newish Audibook collection since they now include a set amount free streaming with Premium membership. I stumbled on a newish production of the first Thrawn novel, Heir to the Empire, and figured "Oh, I used to really like this, and I like the OT era vibe more than the new stuff, so what the heck, let's give it a try." . . . Y'all. I'm floored. It's SO GOOD. I can't believe it took me so long, but I am glad I found it. The new production is PHENOMENAL. It's got the full licensed production with sound effects, the music, etc, and the reader is an incredibly talented voice actor who does striking impressions of the cast. Well, the men anyway. It's almost like one of these fully voice acted productions with a single actor. I was transported back to my youth, and it was like it picked up right right where original Star Wars left off. It felt like Star Wars. It was familiar and comfortable and RIGHT. It was almost like getting a new movie in the original Star Wars movie series, like they kept going without any of the trappings of the prequels or sequels. I'm sure this is old news to many SW fans, but anyone who hasn't read it or wants to revisit, I cannot recommend it enough. This particular production. I've already mainline the rest of the trilogy and looked up the remaining SW novels set in old EU continuity by Zahn as well as the the best and most essential to the plot. Consider me fully reinvested in the old EU. Legends feels more like Star Wars to me than anything that's come from Lucas or Disney in decades, and I saw the fan link above about closure for this continuity. I think I have some content for a while! I loved the Zahn trilogy back when they came out. I've read them again since, maybe 15 or so years ago now. I'll have to check out this audiobook you're talking about. It's on Spotify, right? What's the guy's name who reads it?
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Post by sunofdarkchild on Mar 29, 2024 3:56:50 GMT -5
My strongest memory of the Thrawn trilogy was this one time my father was looking for me and didn't realize I was sitting next to the bookcase in the basement reading Heir to the Empire instead of in my room playing with action figures. He got very frustrated that I wasn't upstairs because we had to drive somewhere, and when he finally found me he shouted, "You were READING?!" It was the first and only time I was yelled at for reading. He had most of the early EU stuff like the Thrawn books, Truce at Bakura, the Jedi Academy and Corellia trilogies, and my older sister had the Young Jedi Knights books that were probably the first Star Wars books I read, though it might have been the books with the 3-eyed guy who claimed to be Palpatine's son and Jabba's father wanting revenge on Leia. The current stories when I was really getting into the EU were the New Jedi Order books. I dropped the EU in high school not because of other interests but because the Legacy of the Force series was so awful and destroyed everything I had enjoyed about the EU.
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